east twin swallet

[joker001]

I went for a little trip into east twin swallet for the first time today. What a complete and utter mess the places is, Looks like a building site. i noticed a sign saying SBCC dig.

[Cookie]

My reaction was the same.

Although it is an active dig, I think a bit of effort should be put into keeping it tidier.

I mentioned it at the last CSCC meeting, but it is not in the minutes, so its probably worth mentioning again.

SBSS 

[joker001]

Im all up for people digging, have even done little bit myself. But the state that place is in Im sorry but there is no need for it. it just needs a good tidy up. Other than that is a nice little cave.

[whitelackington]

I am afraid you are wrong.
Do you think the S.B.S.S. have done all that work, to mess the place up.
Why don't you contact them if you are so concerned.
This dig has fantastic potential but everytime there is a major storm, I am told about every two years the whole of the massive dig face if filled in again by the stream.
They are not alowed to divert the stream as it then rips the road up, that is how powerful the stream in major flood can be.
I am sure once the breakthrough is made and they have then figured out what to do,
lots of the digging stuff can be removed.
I have not dug there, so i am not defending my own actions.

[cap 'n chris]

This dig has fantastic potential

... Surely as the strike-aligned valley is just downstream from the entrance, the most they could hope for would be a narrow fissure connection to Pierre's streamway?....

[Andy Sparrow]

This dig has fantastic potential

Speaking as something of a veteran of Burrington digging I'm not sure this is true.  We know where the stream goes - it has been traced to the upstream sump of Pierres Pot - so this is no back door into the 'Burrington Master Cave'.    Another problem here is that, as indicated by the sumps in Pierres, there is a local perched phreatic zone at about 100m OD and the East Twin dig is very near this level.   There is genuinely fantastic potential between the East Twin and West Twin valleys; Goatchurch is a remarkable cave system which draughts strongly and an extension leading Eastwards is extremely likely IMHO, but this will probably be at a higher level than that of current digging operations in East Twin.

[Andy Sparrow]

This dig has fantastic potential

... Surely as the strike-aligned valley is just downstream from the entrance, the most they could hope for would be a narrow fissure connection to Pierre's streamway?....

We were in synch on than one then, Cap'n!

[cap 'n chris]

Looks like it, Andy.

While it may be a worthwhile exercise to reopen Spar Pot, I wonder whether SBSS's dig at ETS is more a case of "digging where you can, rather than digging where you might find something". Mind you, I haven't been down there for ages so perhaps I'll go and have a nose around in the mud and sharp rocks.

Good luck to them: despite my cynicism they may find something truly wonderful.

[Andy Sparrow]

Good luck to them: despite my cynicism they may find something truly wonderful.

Ditto.  I would be delighted to be proved totally wrong.

[whitelackington]

The S.B.S.S. recently loaned The Axbridge Super Drill to help install their flood debris traps

[Hughie]

Anyone know the vertical difference between the bottom of Goatchurch and the top of Flange Swallet? I could look it up/work it out but my crumpet is getting cold!

[joker001]

I am afraid you are wrong.
Do you think the S.B.S.S. have done all that work, to mess the place up.
Why don't you contact them if you are so concerned.

Why is it as soon as anybody mentions something with a little concern people get straight on there high horse. (here and on darkplaces) Sorry Whitelackington if Ive got your reply all wrong, but thats the way is looks to me.

I am not complaining about the dig I think the dig is fantastic and good luck to them. My concern was the way that all the material is/was left, ie scaffold bar, buckets and bags , tubes are just left all over the floor. 

A bit off topic, but does anyone know the digging potential of pierres pot. I went in there yesterday and couldnt help but noticed all the mud that has built up on the floors in some of the passages.

[graham]

To extend on what Andy and Chris have said, all this shite fluvial debris that is washed in by the streams has to go somewhere and the observant amongst you will have noticed that it doesn't all come out at Rickford.

Such deposits are an important factor in how the underground water courses develop. Amongst other things it can block passages and prevent them from developing further. It is highly probable that the active zone beneath the Combe is not going to be the long hoped for "master streamway" but rather a series of interconnected fissures full, alternatly with water or gravel

[graham]

Anyone know the vertical difference between the bottom of Goatchurch and the top of Flange Swallet? I could look it up/work it out but my crumpet is getting cold!

Tell her to wait, if you're busy.

[whitelackington]

Isn't digging exciting?
Every theory under the sun can be discused.
Only by digging can the answers be glimpsed.

[Peter Burgess]

I was there a few weeks ago with some novices, and thought exactly the same. I had promised them a nice little cave, not visited much, but was shocked at what a total tip the place has become. The whole entrance chamber has been sacrificed as a dump for dig spoil and scaffolding bits. Horrible. I should add that this was my reaction when I saw it. First impressions and all that. If the dig doesn't reveal the hoped-for wonders, will the cave be restored to its former state? Is it possible even?

[Hughie]

I've not been to East Twin for a while, but I recall going to Eastwater whilst the Morton Pot to West End Series was being actively dug, and being quite shocked to see the lower part of the Upper Traverse used as a spoil tip. On reflection, though, that part of the traverse is (was) pretty inaccessible and was quite capable of "stealing" any dropped kit. Also, as a digger myself, I quite understand the utilisation of these areas for spoil storage.

Where I now dig, we make every effort to keep the whole area tidy, as uncluttered as possible, and safe. Even to the extent we control the weed population on the spoil heap. Rubbish is put in a bin, tools are left tidy below ground, locked away above ground. We consider ourselves fortunate to have such a good and helpful landowner and feel that keeping it all neat and tidy is the least we can do.

It doesn't take much effort - just a little group discipline, care & attention.

[cap 'n chris]

... and a warm crumpet from time to time? 

[whitelackington]

Never mind cave diggers leaving shit what about farmers?

[Hughie]

Never mind cave diggers leaving shit what about farmers?

If you were a farmer we could call you Shitelackington!