Brian Andrew Kerr - did he die in Goyden pot?

BlackSheep2

New member
Not much info out there on the web. 1957 the 20 year old art student's belongings were found in Goyden. His body never found. It is suggested that he may have faked his death, does anyone have any further info on this case?
 

langcliffe

Well-known member
The incident is discussed in Lovelock's "Life and Death Underground", pages 104-107. The inquest concluded that in all probability Kerr had died in Goyden.
 

Goydenman

Well-known member
UWFRA searched the system for weeks after and found nothing but items from his camp in Goyden main chamber strewn down the main stream passage. Note the items being there but no body.The sumps were not searched but twenty years later all nine sumps between Goyden and New Goyden had been dived and found nothing. Plus it is clear all debris eg wood does not get through Goyden sump 7 and is washed up into the Aquamole Series and nothing has been found there too. There is report of him being sighted abroad but no strong supportive evidence to back this up. The mystery continues.......
 

BlackSheep2

New member
The system was not searched until one month later. The police put 2 dummy bodies in the cave these were left in flood and were also never found??
 

EwanCameron

New member
I hope he's not lurking in there still !

Wow really 2 X dummy bodies washed into the unknown [emoji37]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

rhychydwr1

Active member
Another ref: The Speleologist No 1 Jan 1965 p 14 The Disappearance of Brian Andrew Kerr by Donald Robinson.

Come on you tup Derbyshire Cavers, two artificial bodies, 12 sheep and Alan Kerr have disappeared in this cave and to date they have not been found.  Pull you fingers out!
 
Err, excuse me, Derbyshire cavers!!  :eek:
Anyway I saw him yesterday at the top end of the Labyrinth chatting to Elvis.  :ras:
 

bograt

Active member
rhychydwr1 said:
Come on you tup Derbyshire Cavers, two artificial bodies, 12 sheep and Alan Kerr have disappeared in this cave and to date they have not been found.  Pull you fingers out!

Sorry, didn't realise Goyden connected with Derbyshire, where would you suggest we start looking Tony?
 

Over the Hill

New member
If you are old enough you will remember a diver going missing in Keld Head. Lots of dives and divers entered the system and never found him. Many years later one Friday night NCC diver Derek Crossland came across a oldham head piece in the murk. Pulled it towards him and on the end of it was ...........  :eek:
 

Goydenman

Well-known member
Well you can take the caver out of Derbys but you can't take Derbys out the caver....so we are digging in that direction........watch this space
 

richardg

Active member
Goydenman said:
Well you can take the caver out of Derbys but you can't take Derbys out the caver....so we are digging in that direction........watch this space

Sentiments that resonate through quite a few of us....... 
 

Clive G

Member
BlackSheep2 said:
Not much info out there on the web. 1957 the 20 year old art student's belongings were found in Goyden. His body never found . . .

According to the Lovelock account he went into Goyden Pot at the end of December 1957 - say 31st December - and was due to return home on 5th January 1958. Now, six days camping underground is a long time - especially if you're on your own.

The items that were found were apparently two sweaters, an anorak, rucksack, food tins, three eggs, a billy-can and water bottles. So, outdoor wear and camping equipment, but no mention of a sleeping bag . . . ? But how could he have kept sufficiently warm over five nights whilst sleeping underground, without a sleeping bag?

The other puzzle is that in his wallet in his anorak (found in the Lower Stream Passage) was some English money, presumably to help with the journey to the cave and back home again, but also "four 1,000 French franc notes." Now, this was 4,000 FF, which, with the old conversion rate of 8 FF to the English pound, comes in at around ?500 - in 1957/8. In 1962 you could buy a large house in a good area in Harrogate for ?2,500! So, what on earth was B.A.K., a 20-year-old Leeds art student, doing with all this money in the first place and why did he take it into the cave with him . . . ? Was he planning to meet someone to make a purchase or just keeping his (French) money with him whilst caving (in England) . . . ?

One other item that was found was a solitary boot. If this was a walking boot, perhaps he had separate footwear for caving? Otherwise, putting all the unexplained factors aside, the place I'd search for his remains would be in roof rifts from where, perhaps, this single boot fell or was washed off, back into the passage below:

"He should have returned home on January 5th - and on this day Goyden was flooded. And when it does flood the water climbs to a height of 12 feet above the cave entrance and the beck comes down like a tidal wave. Those who really know Goyden keep away in winter when the weather is uncertain, or a sudden thaw can send millions of gallons of water down off the moors."
 

Over the Hill

New member
Clive G said:
BlackSheep2 said:
Not much info out there on the web. 1957 the 20 year old art student's belongings were found in Goyden. His body never found . . .
..........................Those who really know Goyden keep away in winter when the weather is uncertain, or a sudden thaw can send millions of gallons of water down off the moors."

With due respect sudden thaws and uncertain weather will flood most caves in Yorkshire but and its a big but Goyden floods without a thaw and any rain. Wind can whip up waves high above on the reservoirs sending water over the retaining wall. Many years ago WRPC members just escaped being drown on a perfect but very windy day.  :coffee:
 

langcliffe

Well-known member
Clive G said:
The other puzzle is that in his wallet in his anorak (found in the Lower Stream Passage) was some English money, presumably to help with the journey to the cave and back home again, but also "four 1,000 French franc notes." Now, this was 4,000 FF, which, with the old conversion rate of 8 FF to the English pound, comes in at around ?500 - in 1957/8. In 1962 you could buy a large house in a good area in Harrogate for ?2,500! So, what on earth was B.A.K., a 20-year-old Leeds art student, doing with all this money in the first place and why did he take it into the cave with him . . . ?

Surely these would have been old francs, as Mr. Kerr would have purchased his francs in 1957, and France didn't introduce the Nouveaux Franc until 1960. The conversion rate in December 1957 was 100 old francs to the equivalent of what is now 9p (which is why they revalued the franc). So the 4,000 French francs would have been worth about ?3.60p - or a little over ?60 in today's money.
 

Clive G

Member
langcliffe said:
. . . So the 4,000 French francs would have been worth about ?3.60p - or a little over ?60 in today's money.

Thanks for pointing out the change in value from the old to the nouveau franc, which I hadn't taken into account.

I've found a conversion rate for the mid-1950s which gives:

?1 = $2.8
350 FF = $1

So, 4,000FF = $11.43 = ?4.08  (mid-1950s)

$11.43 (1957) = $96.30 (2014) = ?65.30 (2015)

Still, what he was doing taking the equivalent of ?65 worth of French Francs into the cave, who knows?
 

BlackSheep2

New member
Ok so he had 60 quid with him but in French cash. You would think he would have taken that out with him if he had faked his death.
Still no closer to solving the mystery. There were rumours that he's alive living in Australia.
 

rhychydwr1

Active member
Alex said:
Sorry, didn't realise Goyden connected with Derbyshire, where would you suggest we start looking Tony?

Well definitely coming next thurday then!

This highlights one of the problems of living in Wales, I know where England is, but have no idea of where  Yorkshire end and Derbyshire begins.

But to get back to my original request:


"Two artificial bodies, 12 sheep and Alan Kerr have disappeared in this cave and to date they have not been found.  Pull you fingers out!"

 
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