Recent news has come through from a veterinary contact that there has been a marked increase in cases of Weils Disease in recent months, and particularly with relevance to cavers. Therefore please keep it in the back of your mind that if you go down with a flu-like malaise you should notify your GP to test for WD in case you have been exposed to it through caving. This is not a regional alert, but national. It is believed the heavy rains washed a lot of infected urine from farm buildings into watercourses and this could be the reason for the noted increase in cases.

http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/leptospirosis/pages/introduction.aspx

Thanks for the heads up, Chris. Two friends of mine both ended up in hospital with that. It's no joke.

It certainly isn't a joke; it got me early January (from caving, at a site I'd visited almost 100 times over the preceding 60 month without problem). I'm very pleased that Chris has flagged this up because awareness is everything. The information on the BCA website is very good; taking a print out to the doctor is advisable because not all GPs are especially aware of this bacterium.

Another problem you might find is the "get past the receptionist if you can" issue, which you'll not feel like facing if you've got Leptospirosis. Insist on speaking to the triage doctor and try to have a coherent story; explain that, as a caver, you are in a high risk group. Your aim is to get on the antibiotics as soon as possible. Don't mess about if you think you've got Leptospirosis; if you don't get treated soon enough it can be fatal.

In case it helps - my symptoms were identical to (genuine) influenza without the runny nose for the first 5 days. After that it got really bad (liver inflamed, jaundice, urine looking like Pernod with blackcurrant in, etc). I didn't eat properly for a week and a half and lost a lot of weight. Fortunately my doctor did get me on the right pills just as the really bad symptoms were starting, so I knew I'd be fine eventually. (He actually bypassed the diagnostic blood test, to reduce any delay in starting the antibiotics.) But it's the most ill I've ever felt and I wasn't fully right till mid March.

The good news is that exposure to the Leptospira bacterium may result in the development of immunity to the particular strain which infects you - but not, of course, to any other strains of the bacterium. I was told this by three separate doctors, one of whom is an infectious disease specialist - but it was opinions rather than certainties. However, I've been back to the place where I caught the disease several times since my own infection and I've not become reinfected. I do know of a caver who has had the disease twice though - maybe he was hit by two different strains.

Incidentally a certain person who knows more about illness than most - and who is a regular contributor to this forum - was incredibly helpful to me with advice when I was ill. I got the opportunity to thank him in person last week but I'd also like to express my gratitude here too. He knows who he is!

I would like to know where this site is so I can avoid it.

Alex said:

I would like to know where this site is so I can avoid it.

Click to expand...

England.

Seriously Alex, this is a nationwide issue, just singling out one site may make folks complacent when it comes to others. There is, potentially, a lot of this about at the moment, so watch for symptoms rather than just avoiding sites.

Agreed, watch out for the symptoms and get a print out of the BCA leaflet to take to your GP, as already pointed out, it is not something they come across very often and the more information they get the better equiped they are to handle it.

An excellent first person experience Pitlamp, I think it would be ironic if we lost you to an unpredictable risk, considering all the other risks you have predicted and overcome! 

bograt said:

Agreed, watch out for the symptoms and get a print out of the BCA leaflet to take to your GP, as already pointed out, it is not something they come across very often and the more information they get the better equiped they are to handle it.

Click to expand...

http://british-caving.org.uk/wiki3/lib/exe/fetch.php?media=publications_information:bca_weils_disease_leaflet.pdf

thanx all for the info / links. I will distribute this among the other Darfar PC members. (Who tend not to wear sufficient PPE!)

Thanks, Les W.

mmilner said:

thanx all for the info / links. I will distribute this among the other Darfar PC members. (Who tend not to wear sufficient PPE!)

Click to expand...

Difficult to determine PPE against Weills  :-\

Difficult to determine PPE against Weills  :-\
[/quote]


Might Work?

Is there any indication as to which caves, types of caves or conditions may be more risky? I was planning to take my son down Manor Farm Swallet next week. IT's likely to rain a bit over the next few days. Is this a seriously bad idea?

David Rose said:

Is there any indication as to which caves, types of caves or conditions may be more risky?

Click to expand...

No. Some caves have a history of WD but as mentioned earlier this might generate complacency if people start to categorise sites. Keep calm and cave on but if you have an inexplicable bout of feeling unwell get checked. However, IF the vector is what they believe it to be, namely run off from farm land near buildings, into a cave with a watercourse, then you can do your own risk assessment accordingly for sites you visit.

If in doubt don't delay is my lesson. A friend, a farmer took over farm where previous tenant had left dead animals in the barn. He cleared them out with bare hands and then went down with what he thought was flu so did the doc told to go to bed plenty of paracetamol. Did not get better doctor rushed him to hospital. But too late died late that day. If it had been suspected earlier and he got the jab there would have been no problem at all and quick recovery. Compare that with one of our club members who had symptoms like flu after cave digging with water inlet from farm nearby so asked for the jab and the doctor said yes because even if not the case it would do her no harm at all.

Goydenman said:

If in doubt don't delay is my lesson. A friend, a farmer took over farm where previous tenant had left dead animals in the barn. He cleared them out with bare hands and then went down with what he thought was flu so did the doc told to go to bed plenty of paracetamol. Did not get better doctor rushed him to hospital. But too late died late that day. If it had been suspected earlier and he got the jab there would have been no problem at all and quick recovery. Compare that with one of our club members who had symptoms like flu after cave digging with water inlet from farm nearby so asked for the jab and the doctor said yes because even if not the case it would do her no harm at all.

Click to expand...

Agreed, a neighbour of ours, a walker, thirty years ago also failed to get treatment and died very quickly.

graham said:

Alex said:

I would like to know where this site is so I can avoid it.

Click to expand...

England.

Seriously Alex, this is a nationwide issue, just singling out one site may make folks complacent when it comes to others. There is, potentially, a lot of this about at the moment, so watch for symptoms rather than just avoiding sites.

Click to expand...

Are Wales and Scotland OK then?

I had thought that dry conditions, not wet ones, increased the risk, because concentrations of the bacteria would be higher. Is that wrong?

bograt said:

mmilner said:

thanx all for the info / links. I will distribute this among the other Darfar PC members. (Who tend not to wear sufficient PPE!)

Click to expand...

Difficult to determine PPE against Weills  :-\

Click to expand...

No it isn't! Gloves, waterproof or at least water resistant clothing. It's not rocket science, most cavers will be wearing this stuff anyway, but it's obv. best to err on the side of caution. If you've got any cuts or abrasions on your skin cover them with waterproof plasters. It's standard H&S training on environmental conservation courses like the one I attended.

Hi David
I'm not an expert but the information leaflet above says
"The leptospira organism is passed in the rats? urine and, while it does not live long in dry conditions, can survive some time in water. "

Hope that helps.

With regard to the question posed by David Rose:-
bear in mind that most cases are found in sewer workers and that some of the most vulnerable people are those who indulge in water activities in places like docks and waterways in cities. On Mendip the most well-known case was the infection of Dr Oliver Lloyd in Stoke Lane Slocker. He was, at the time, the Secretary of the Mendip Rescue Organization and became extremely ill and thereafter warned cavers to take the threat seriously.