Idiots
- Thread starter graham
- Start date
Peter Burgess
New member
If you don't tell us a bit more, Graham, then there wasn't much point in posting!!!
Tony_B
Member
SamT said:
I agree, and unless anyone comes up with a very compelling reason not to (PM me if you prefer) I'll be happy to provide details on exactly what has been stolen, on this forum, as I am one of a number who have been asked to contribute information to the investigation.
Sorry to be vague (at the moment) but I'm a bit surprised that, as this is pretty much in the public domain already, no-one has seen fit to elaborate and I can only assume there's a reason. I would have thought that the wider and the sooner this is made public the more likely it is the matter will be resolved. Or am I being thick?
Rhys
Moderator
Tony
I agree with you entirely. I can't see the harm in the basic facts being known, so long as speculation and accusations are kept under control here (I'll monitor this). I have received some basic info by PM, but as it's very much second hand for me, I'd prefer it if someone truly in the loop made a factual statement.
Rhys
I agree with you entirely. I can't see the harm in the basic facts being known, so long as speculation and accusations are kept under control here (I'll monitor this). I have received some basic info by PM, but as it's very much second hand for me, I'd prefer it if someone truly in the loop made a factual statement.
Rhys
Tony_B
Member
I can't claim to be 'truly in the loop'. All I can offer is this: on Thurs night SWCC, in common with other key-holders, was asked to account for the whereabouts of our Draenan key on Wed 7th July when, it is alleged, the gates for both Ogof Draenan and Drws Cefn were removed. A police inquiry was mentioned and all responses to this post should bear that in mind. I presume this is the incident to which Graham's original post refers.
As one of my correspondents has pointed out, the last thing this forum needs is another volley of arguments, finger-pointing and ranting about the rights and wrongs of alternative entrances and so on. Such tirades get us nowhere and harm the public image of caving, and, as a moderator, Rhys, I trust that you will not allow this thread to degenerate into that.
However, in the light of earlier responses to Graham's post, I thought that it was time the air was cleared and the situation explained. Anyone who can shed any useful light on this incident should presumably contact the PDCMG.
As one of my correspondents has pointed out, the last thing this forum needs is another volley of arguments, finger-pointing and ranting about the rights and wrongs of alternative entrances and so on. Such tirades get us nowhere and harm the public image of caving, and, as a moderator, Rhys, I trust that you will not allow this thread to degenerate into that.
However, in the light of earlier responses to Graham's post, I thought that it was time the air was cleared and the situation explained. Anyone who can shed any useful light on this incident should presumably contact the PDCMG.
Peter Burgess
New member
If the gates have been removed (stolen) without the owners' consent then a theft has taken place i.e. a crime. Regardless of the arguments about whether the gates are a good idea or not, this is a regrettable thing to have happened showing that someone is prepared to break the law to make a point. I may not agree with things that are decided by other cavers but I would not break the law to get what I want. There are plenty of people on this and other forums who express righteous indignation about law-breaking. Will they express the same view over the removal of these gates, assuming it was a criminal act, of course? Or do they not post here any more for one reason or another?
Peter Burgess
New member
Would someone remove both sets of gates if all they wanted was scrap metal? I think this is a very unlikely explanation given that if anyone wanted to nick metal there are far more convenient targets to go for that are not locked and can just be picked up from any street.
shortscotsman
New member
From the original entrance to Draenen, the path to the road is pretty steep with a fence to climb and houses nearby.
If I was looking for scrap metal it's not where I'd start. 7th July is four days after the last meeting of the PDCMG.
I'm not sure who the gates would belong to. Althougth the landholder has to give permission for them to
be installed they wouldn't automatically belong to him/her.
If I was looking for scrap metal it's not where I'd start. 7th July is four days after the last meeting of the PDCMG.
I'm not sure who the gates would belong to. Althougth the landholder has to give permission for them to
be installed they wouldn't automatically belong to him/her.
Hughie
Active member
Scrap prices have been steadily falling since the highs of last year, made a minor recovery in the spring, and now resumed a steady decline. Local yard is around 70% of the high prices (for mixed/heavy) - have heard others down by as much as 50%.
I think Peter is right - there are easier places to lift greater quantities of scrap (unless the gates are made of copper).
I think Peter is right - there are easier places to lift greater quantities of scrap (unless the gates are made of copper).
darwen dave
New member
I wouldn't completely rule out the idea of casual theft.
We get the ferrous swarf pile at work nicked regularly, even if there's only a wheelbarrow full.
This suits us though because normally we have to pay to have it taken away.
We get the ferrous swarf pile at work nicked regularly, even if there's only a wheelbarrow full.
This suits us though because normally we have to pay to have it taken away.
