How to survey 101

D

darkplaces

Guest
Hello,

I have an interest in surveying mines and have made a few attempts at grade 1 maybe 2 surveys. I have progressed to angles and distances and plotting them in a way to create a map that fits together. I am currently using Visio as I cant find anything that just lets me plot straight lines at a set distance and angle.

Now you know what level I am at could anyone help me with surveying, maybe I could help out to survey a cave or mine your working on, be an extra bod to hold the tape or please post any hints and tips from your vast personal experiance welcome.

Thank you
 

menacer

Active member
Not too sure what youor after however many cavers use "survex" freely downloadable on the web complete with instructions on how to use...
If your about at the weekend I'll bring up my computer and show you to start you off.
What instruments do you use,
a popular brand is suunto, the tandem is a compass and clino in one.
Buy one from the usa 2nd hand for as little as £70 (the geographical settings are the same as uk)
 

menacer

Active member
Les W said:
You can come and survey with me sometime  ;)

Somewhere in Swildons perhaps

Of course some people are lucky enough to be going out to matienzo soon where there is ALWAYS surveying going on.
Forgot to mention "Tunnel" another surveying package, dont know if its readily available or not...
 

Les W

Active member
menacer said:
a popular brand is suunto, the tandem is a compass and clino in one.
Buy one from the usa 2nd hand for as little as £70 (the geographical settings are the same as uk)

Or as you are a Wessex member you could borrow one of the clubs survey instrument sets  :-\
 

Les W

Active member
menacer said:
Les W said:
You can come and survey with me sometime  ;)

Somewhere in Swildons perhaps

Of course some people are lucky enough to be going out to matienzo soon where there is ALWAYS surveying going on.

You not going this Easter then Menacer  :halo:
 
D

darkplaces

Guest
oo Thanks Mr Les W yes I would like to come along and help survey.

The equipment I have used is a simple Silva compass and 100ft tape measure. The enviroments I am surveying don't need any inclination. I'll try them programs again but they all seamed to be windows 98 and way too complex for what I want. I'm off to North Wales this weekend to do some work on the Cwmorthin slate mine http://www.cwmorthin.co.uk/ otherwise yes I would like to meet up and sort out some proper survey software. Mind you Visio is producing some good results.
 

Les W

Active member
Survex is the program of choice - http://survex.com/ - runs on everything!

I will be doing LOTS of surveying next week in MATIENZO using survex, then lots of drinking in Bar German and in Bar Thomas and in the "smoothie bar" and in "Arkwrights bar", oh and in Rianio Bar, etc.  :tease: :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer:

Sorry Menacer  :LOL:
 

menacer

Active member
c**tplaces said:
I'll try them programs again but they all seamed to be windows 98 and way too complex for what I want.

It works on xp.
It is too complex if using "notepad" is a problem.
For your data you would write...

*begin box mines east extension

0 1 3.8 225 0
1 2 5.4 256 0
2 3 12 312 0
3 4 6.2 360 0
*end box mines east extension

Where the 1st two numbers denote the survey legs, 225 is the compass, 0 is the clino and 3.8 is in metres.
save the notepad file as a .svx file
then right click and use survex to process the file... voila. Line survey....
Easy Peasy lemon squeezy.

give it a go



 

Peter Burgess

New member
c**tplaces said:
Hello,

I have an interest in surveying mines and have made a few attempts at grade 1 maybe 2 surveys. I have progressed to angles and distances and plotting them in a way to create a map that fits together. I am currently using Visio as I cant find anything that just lets me plot straight lines at a set distance and angle.

Now you know what level I am at could anyone help me with surveying, maybe I could help out to survey a cave or mine your working on, be an extra bod to hold the tape or please post any hints and tips from your vast personal experiance welcome.

Thank you

Hi DP:

Are the mines you want to survey effectively level, or dipping no more than 10 or so degrees? In which case, try the article below for some ideas. The advice you have so far will provide you with a line survey, but the real value of a good mine survey is in the detail, which you add to the survey. The notes in the article about taking offsets, and making good sketches and notes to add details to your line survey are important.

If you are talking about steep slopes and vertical sections, then obviously the extra dimension makes a big difference to how you create your line survey, but the addition of detail is much the same procedure - offsets and good sketch notes.

A shallow dip angle will not have an appreciable affect on the accuracy of a plan survey if you assume it to be level, unless you want to really super accurate.

http://www.wcms.org.uk/pages/u2nl1983_1.shtml#surveying_chaldon_spring1983
 

Peter Burgess

New member
I should add that it is important to make the notes and offsets at the time you do each leg of the line survey, and not at a later date! Don't be tempted to rush ahead with just the line work without details, as in the long term it will take longer if you want a good detailed result.

 

graham

New member
When surveying, even in mines, please please please take inclination data as well as length and direction (and the passage detail Peter talks about). You may not think it adds much to the accuracy of your plan, but those using your data set in years to come, geologists for example, will be extremely grateful for teh small extra effort taken.
 

Peter Burgess

New member
In an evenly-dipping bed of stone, the angle of dangle need only be measured later at key points in the workings, to add the required geological value. In folded and distorted beds, assuming the mine is following a particular bed, Graham's comment is a good one. The Surrey mines are by and large in gently folded strata and the plan survey, which was undertaken primarily for archaeological reasons, is perfectly adequate.
 
W

Walrus

Guest
menacer said:
c**tplaces said:
I'll try them programs again but they all seamed to be windows 98 and way too complex for what I want.

It works on xp.
It is too complex if using "notepad" is a problem.
For your data you would write...

*begin box mines east extension

0 1 3.8 225 0
1 2 5.4 256 0
2 3 12 312 0
3 4 6.2 360 0
*end box mines east extension

Where the 1st two numbers denote the survey legs, 225 is the compass, 0 is the clino and 3.8 is in metres.
save the notepad file as a .svx file
then right click and use survex to process the file... voila. Line survey....
Easy Peasy lemon squeezy.

give it a go

I tried this application on two XP machines; one wouldn't run (kept getting a DOS error) and the other ran but wouldn't read the supplied test data. I'll acquire a copy of Visio and try DP's method!
 

Peter Burgess

New member
Another thing to think about is magnetic variation. You should take this into account, of course, when you are plotting your results, but there is one other factor which many don't bother with. That is temporary magnetic variation anomalies, caused by things like solar storms.

Every survey session, you should do a check bearing between two known points. This should be consistently the same every time, apart from the normal drift of magnetic north over the years, which won't be an issue if your survey only takes a few weeks. However, if you get a temporary anomaly in mag north, the check bearing you take will pick it up. In all the years of surveying in Surrey, we only noticed this once, but had we not allowed for it in the plotting, we would have had some errors, and poor loop misclosures.

For our check bearing, we used a sturdy (non-steel) gate-post, and sighted onto a clearly visible mast a few kilometres away, with a bright red light on top. Useful, for late night surveying! Only problems were on foggy nights, but I can't recall this being a problem very often.
 
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