advice on caves s.wales (clydach gorge area)

S

skinner

Guest
hello, i will be going to s.wales in couple weeks time to lead some inexperienced cavers, this will be my first lead without having someone who knows the cave systems. i was wondering if there was any caves you would suggest which are ideal for new cavers and which is quite easy to get around. will be around a 4hour trip.

i was looking at Porth yr Ogof but it might be to far away from the place we are staying. the other one is Ogof Draenen but apparently it is very complex and navigation skills are needed up to scratch!! thanks
 

NigR

New member
skinner said:
the other one is Ogof Draenen but apparently it is very complex and navigation skills are needed up to scratch!!

Hi skinner,

Yes it is complex and I would suggest that it is totally unsuitable for your needs.

Where are you staying?
 

Huge

Active member
It's a little difficult recommending trips when you don't know the people but :-

Draenen's not too complex if you don't go too far from the entrance. A nice first trip in the cave is to go a little way up Gilwern Passage (just as far as the inlet falling from the roof into the pool) and then back to Tea Junction and head down the streamway as far as the first choke. How about Lamb and Fox chamber. You'd probably want to ladder the climb in Pitch Bypass for inexperienced people and it's quite a steep and tiring pull up from Cairn Junction out to the entrance. It all depends on your and your charges, abilities.

Other options :-

Aggy
Ogof Tardiadd Rhymney
Llanelly Quarry Pot (has a pitch)

Can't see how you could get a four hour trip out of Porth yr Ogof.
 
Agen Allwedd has the following restriction:

The leader of the party is responsible for ensuring that the party is adequately equipped, for the conduct of the party, and for ensuring that the trip is not beyond the capabilities of any of the party. He / she must have attained the age of 18 years. Cavers with limited experience are only permitted in a ratio of no more than 1:1 to experienced cavers. Overall responsibility rests with the club to which the permit has been issued.

Llanelly Quarry Pot is a tricky pitch not really suitable for novices.

Try Shakespears and Clogwyn and the walk between should fill the time.
 
Ogof clogwyn is a simple resurgence cave but it is really a special cave - with a bit of everything streamway, crawling etc..

We found it harder to find than to do, but eventually we did it quite a few times including as a childrens caving trip in there too.

Here is the our route - click the image for a link to the interactive flickr notes



Here is the map for finding the place - again click the image to go to the flickr page



 

manrabbit

Member
Ogof Nant Rhin in the Clydach gorge is a lovely active little cave with a stream flowing out of the entrance crawl. Located just over the river bank by the largest lay-by (nearest Brynmawr), watch for the little pink loo roll parcels left in the grass by the lorry drivers thoughjavascript:void(0);!!. I took my two boys aged 8 and 11 in there a few months ago and they both thoroughly loved it. If you do decide on Clogwyn, the gorge has become extremely overgrown with brambles since the sheep have been removed from the area, trying to get to the cave from the head of the valleys road is a nightmare!

 
 

Razzerip1

New member
Where are you staying?

Eglwys faen and Ogof Pen Eryr, both easy caves and a nice walk in between.

Don't confuse Pen Eryr with Daren Cilau like a group of cavers did this year and wondered what all the fuss was about.

Little Neath River cave is not to demanding apart from the entrance which is dependant on the weather and can flood in heavy rain. It's a fantastic trip.

3676832920_29770afac4_o.jpg


Little Neath Entrance
 

Huge

Active member
Rereading skinners post, maybe my suggestions were pitched a bit high. It seems we have an inexperienced group lead by an inexperienced leader.

It was the need for a four hour trip that lead me to the suggestions I made. Doing two or more smaller caves seems like a good idea.

Mind you, it depends on the individuals. I know someone who's first trip was Daren Cilau and someone else who's third ever trip was to Luck of the Draw in Draenen pushing new passage! 
 

Alkapton

Member
Whilst Ogof Nant Rhin is one of my very favorite caves, it has an awkward and very very wet entrance, there are a couple of very tight places, I don't think its the place to take complete novices.  Ogof Clogwyn is excellent for novices.  Continue down the main passage till it sumps.  On the way back at one of the right angle bends you can climb onto a boulder and up into a higher passage (on your right on way back out), this becomes rift, stay high in rift, eventually you see daylight and there is a chamber on the right.  On way back dont climb back down but go back into rift and stay low in the rift.  A low crawl on the left (if going in from main streamway) will take you to a hole in the roof of the main streamway which is a very easy climb down.

Then you will have time to go to Waterfall Cave in the nearby blackrock quarry.  The quarry has a private keep out sign.  The sign is not aimed at cavers it is aimed at travllers (= theiving bastards as far as owner is concerned)  go up to quarry face and walk along it to your left.  Eventually you see a small cave with a stream coming out.  Do not go in that cave unless you suffer from anorexia!!!  You can either follow stream through a concrete drainage tunnel or walk over the top of the quarry and down into another bit of quarry where you will see a nice large cave entrance.    Mostly a single easy passage.  Eventually you come to an awkward 2.5 meter drop (the waterfall)  It is possible to get down using the very large boulder just inside the chamber, but perhaps take a rope or ladder for weaker or smaller climbers.    At far end of chamber, on the left I think, is a tight hole down into a second lower chamber, from here you can get to other chambers.  Very nice little cave.

I'd warn against Shakespers because it is difficult to get to.  The walk along the top of the gorge is narrow and trecherous in places.  I know at least one person has fallen over the edge, it is a walk of fear.  The easy way is the long way round from the back of the railway tunnels (climb down the wrong side of the cycle way into Cwm Pwch, and from there walk down an adit - the bottom of two adits - there is a slippy little drop half way but its easy enougth then just continue down the right hand side of the Cwm.) Also you will want wet suits.  And watch the weather

Waterfall and Clogwyn should fit your time scale nicely though.
 

maxb727

Member
Skinner,

If you are who I think you are, talk to James, he will advise you accordingly as he knows your abilities. Also if you ask the South Wales CC they may have a couple of people willing to help you lead around OFD and such like.

Sorry for stealing James that weekend, I am running the Great South Run and wanted a supporter!

Max
 

mrodoc

Well-known member
I agree with the advice on Shakespeare's Cave. The approach is terribly exposed with no protection from plummeting over a cliff if you slide down the slope. Also Shakespeare's is more an experience than a pleasant trip. A winding rift leads to an awkward crawl with an awkward duck and a wet short awkward streamway! More a collector's item that you only do once IMHO :thumbsdown:
 

slippery_matt

New member
mrodoc said:
I agree with the advice on Shakespeare's Cave. The approach is terribly exposed with no protection from plummeting over a cliff if you slide down the slope. Also Shakespeare's is more an experience than a pleasant trip. A winding rift leads to an awkward crawl with an awkward duck and a wet short awkward streamway! More a collector's item that you only do once IMHO :thumbsdown:

depends on how you approach it.  Why don't you have a splash down the streamway down to it? 

The way I approached for the first time was to descend past the entrance to Ogof Capel down to the stream - the inlet pretty much opposite leads to the cave...  Easy enough & no death cliffs of doom to avoid.

Would have to agree on the whole though, not the most inspirational place, even if I did enjoy it!

How about a trip to the Hall of the Mountain King in Craig yr Ffynnon (sp?).  In the right area, nice and easy, amazing place, can't get lost unless you try.
 

damian

Active member
If this is the university novices that I suspect it is, then I strongly recommend Eglwys Faen and Pen Eryr with a cake a tea break back at the car/minibus between the two trips.

On Sunday you would do far worse than going to Ogof Tardiadd Rhymney or Ogof Clogwyn.

Another option, as Maxine suggests, is to get yourself some OFD permits and a good copy of the survey and/or some helpers to show you around.

In my opinion, all other suggestions made so far are probably inappropriate.
 
S

skinner

Guest
hiya thanks for the replies, sorry been change off plan on where we are staying (because of the climbers) we are now staying at The Gower. there is not much caving around there so will have to drive somewhere further. Best bet I was considering is going around the SWCC hut, then we could use it afterwards for getting changed. But on the Gower there is Tooth Cave and Llethrid Swallet which could be considered ( cant find lots of info tho.)

Since it is newbies I will not be going to any sumps on the route as will be a bit of a challenge for them.

I have been in OFD2 going in at Ogof Y Nos Hir making the way down to the Shatter Pilliar. Another trip making it to 'Swamp Creek.'  also been in Cwm Dwr. so know roughly some of the cave.

Hi max yea going be seeing James on wed to get his Knowledge since you have nicked him from me!

yea it is uni, if i didn't like something I would just turn back, anyway people don't really take much notice when they are on there first caving trip anyway!

thanks
 

Tony_B

Member
skinner said:
But on the Gower there is Tooth Cave and Llethrid Swallet which could be considered ( cant find lots of info tho.)

Skinner, I am told that Llethrid Swallet is currently blocked by flood debris, to the extent that it is inaccessible and likely to remain so for the foreseeable.

If you are staying on Gower a visit to SWCC is probably your best bet. For a trip in OFD you will need a permit and please, please don't be too ambitious; there have been a good few callouts in the last couple of years for parties lost while attempting through-trips and the like.

If you need any more info about the possibilities at SWCC then please ask...
 

NigR

New member
skinner said:
But on the Gower there is Tooth Cave and Llethrid Swallet which could be considered ( cant find lots of info tho.)

Don't want to sound too negative but in my opinion neither Tooth nor Llethrid are suitable for complete novices.

(And if you do decide to go to either please keep a close eye on weather conditions).
 

rhychydwr1

Active member
skinner said:
hiya thanks for the replies, sorry been change off plan on where we are staying (because of the climbers) we are now staying at The Gower. there is not much caving around there so will have to drive somewhere further. Best bet I was considering is going around the SWCC hut, then we could use it afterwards for getting changed. But on the Gower there is Tooth Cave and Llethrid Swallet which could be considered ( cant find lots of info tho.)

There is a book  ;)
 

shortscotsman

New member
Hi,

although Tooth and Llethrid  are on Gower, they have to be treated with caution. Both flood.
Access to Tooth requires a trip to SWCC which makes it frustratingly inconvenient if you are based on Gower.


I live in Swansea, and, IMHO, the two nearest sensibl-ish caves are

Llygadd Lwychwr, (LL)

Ogof Pasg/ Foel Fawr (OP)

both are in the Western Brecon/Black Mountain and are about 30-40 minutes drive from Swansea and are both
a short walk.  I've taken small groups of complete novices to LL.  Both are open access. Both take a couple of hours underground. (you can do both in a day). LL is very easy to find. OP a little harder.

LL is fine in all weather conditions, it has a `interesting entry' which is aided with a couple of slings. It has the advantage that if someone can get in  then you can expect them to get through the cave OK. 

The entrance to OP is a little scramble up a quarry face. I don't particularly like this when its wet and slippy but its fine when dry.  There is a `duck' which may sump. [haven't been there in the last month but water levels are possibly low at present -anyone been there recently?] but is bypassable by a short abseil. Ogof Pasg connects via a tight squeeze (the press) to Ogof Foel Fawr. 

Both are, I find, interesting without being technical. LL has a lot of clambering around in, OP has more crawling .

Locations of the cave (and piccie of the press) at http://www.ogof.org.uk. The descriptions  in ``Caves of South Wales''
by Stratford are fine as are those in ``Caves of Carmarthenshire'' by Oldham.


 

NigR

New member
shortscotsman said:
There is a `duck' which may sump. [haven't been there in the last month but water levels are possibly low at present -anyone been there recently?]

Sump should be open now. A friend of mine got through OK a couple of weeks ago and it hasn't rained much since.
 
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