Passive smoking bats

gus horsley

gus horsley

New member
I recently did a trip to ***** Mine and saw a bunch of a dozen or so guys changing out of their oversuits at the car park. Said hello, etc, then went underground. At a certain point there's normally a colony of greater horseshoe bats, except on this occasion there wasn't, only a dissipating cloud of cigarette smoke. It seemed a bit of a coincidence that this was the only place that I could see and smell fag smoke and the only place the bats are usually found. I didn't see any bats on that trip although counts of 50 plus are regular. There wasn't much I could do except fume (pardon the pun).

I've been exploring caves and mines for over 40 years and in this time I've noticed what I think is a different attitude towards mine and cave conservation, possibly because one environment is natural and the other artificial.
 
P

Peter Burgess

New member
A colony of Greater Horsehoe bats of that size found round here would get the place instantly gated and access removed for ever. Has anyone ever promoted the gating of this mine? On the basis of what you have written, some people would advocate having access severely restricted at least during the winter months. Has the weather warmed up much around the time of the trip? It's getting close to wakey wakey time for bats.
 
gus horsley

gus horsley

New member
Gating ***** would be very difficult as it has several entrances (including a large one in a sea cave) and the granite is very kaolinised. Otherwise I think it would have been gated - there are many in Cornwall which have been gated to protect the bats. The trip in question took place in December and the bats were there a couple of weeks earlier. They have not returned as far as I can tell, unless they've moved to an inaccessible part of the mine. The colony is/was at a mid-point in the workings and is concentrated in a 40ft high rise. The bats cling to various timbers because the wall rock is too soft. Unfortunately there is nothing at the top of the rise, so any pollution tends to just stay there.
 
P

Peter Burgess

New member
I recall once on a visit to Cornwall in high summer 1977 or 78, seeing a large number of bats (probably GH as they looked like large birds) flying about above the gullies west of Trevaunance Cove, (ie. east of Polberro). It was dusk. I have since heard that there was once an important roost in a mine near here, which was destroyed when all the shafts were capped. I was just getting into mine exploration at the time, and I have not seen so many GHBs in one place since.
 
gus horsley

gus horsley

New member
Probably was Polberro Mine which extends for some distance along the coast and was capped around 1980. You can still get into the workings but the abseil in is scary to say the least. I believe the bats are still there, they just can't fly out of the shafts any more. Incidentally there's a huge sea cave below the cliffs there - it's about 1,000 ft long and averages 50ft square and the waves hammer through it spectacularly.
 
graham

graham

New member
And here is the conservation/access dilemma in a nutshell. Does the right to go where the hell they like of the explorer override the right of these bats to have an undisturbed kip through the winter?

Please bear in mind that I am not implying any malice on the part of the smokers that Gus saw.
 
cap n chris

cap n chris

Well-known member
graham said:
And here is the conservation/access dilemma in a nutshell. Does the right to go where the hell they like of the explorer override the right of these bats to have an undisturbed kip through the winter?
Click to expand...

Put simply, no.

Also, I wouldn't be in the slightest bit surprised if English Nature (soon to be Natural England) watchers pick up on this thread and gate the place especially if GHBs are present and people are failing to abide by the self-regulation of non-smoking underground, particularly anywhere near bats during winter.
 
gus horsley

gus horsley

New member
Shouldn't be a problem with English Nature since they would consult me first about it. But I've edited out the name of the mine just in case.
 
P

Peter Burgess

New member
Gus wrote:

I've been exploring caves and mines for over 40 years and in this time I've noticed what I think is a different attitude towards mine and cave conservation, possibly because one environment is natural and the other artificial.
Click to expand...

There is a difference in attitude, but its not universal.

Those with a greater interest in mines, as I have observed it, tend to be protective towards the mines and their history and archaeology, and if they also visit natural caves, tend to do so more for the sport and for fun, and perhaps have less of a scientific interest in the cave.

Those whose primary interest is the exploration, discovery, and study of caves tend to think of mines as convenient undeground holes close to home where they can go and let off steam as there are no natural caves nearby to explore.

These are simple generalisations and I know they certainly don't apply to everyone. They are just attitudes I have noticed in some people over the years.
 
gus horsley

gus horsley

New member
Peter, I agree with your observations. Maybe the contrast looks starker to me because I'm interested in the scientific aspects and conservation of both caves and mines. It's a complex and potentially thorny issue.
 
P

Peter Burgess

New member
When I first started getting interested in the ancient mines close to home, the people I got involved with were a mix of cavers and mine explorers, as indeed they are today. We had a certain amount of equipment available. When questioning the crappy condition of the ladders available for getting into the mines, the answer was typically, "well it's only for the mines, isn't it?" We were even borrowing kit from another club for a while. Fortunately that attitude didn't last long.
 
gus horsley

gus horsley

New member
Peter, did a couple of trips down your way, long time ago. I remember one that went past a load of concrete plugs under a dual carriageway. Quite bizarre but good stals as I remember.
 
P

Peter Burgess

New member
Gus

Its all still there. A real treasure house of history for those who care to look for it. The grouted section that you refer to only destroyed a small part of the whole system.

Peter
 
gus horsley

gus horsley

New member
Peter

I wonder if we met. It would have been about 15 years ago, I went on the trip with the local group and we had a long discussion about caving politics in a pub afterwards. Then again, that could be any weekend I suppose.
 
P

Peter Burgess

New member
Gus

Just looked at my log from about 1987 to 1993 but couldn't see anything obvious. Could have been someone else who met you, especially after 1995.
 
gus horsley

gus horsley

New member
Peter

It would have been in 1991 I think. And it might have been an evening trip, midweek, but my memory's starting to play tricks on me nowadays - getting old.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top