I was reminded of the existence of this cave recently - does anyone know if it's been pushed (or even entered) since the 1970s?

It seemed to have a lot of potential, both upstream toward Penyghent Gill and downstream towards Boreham Cave etc. The last I heard was that the upstream sump had been passed to a streamway/chamber with a waterfall entering.

I believe that access problems developed - and it's a scary place, given that the entrance is in the (normally dry) riverbed.

What a coincodence! I've pm'ed you by the way.

Hi,
According to the 1995 Northern Sump Index (post dating NC1), the entrance has collapsed and the farmer is not allowing access. 

It does sound good though!

George.

Langthwaite Pot said:

According to the 1995 Northern Sump Index (post dating NC1), the entrance has collapsed and the farmer is not allowing access. 

Click to expand...

A genuine collapse seems unlikely; as I recall, it was a pretty solid rift from which a lot of rocks were removed - I would think it just got filled in again.

I guess nothing has changed since 1995?

Paul Monico, who produced the most recent Northern Sump Index, contacted me today about this. He isn't registered to post things on this forum but he suggested that I could add the following to this thread, just for completeness. All of the following is copied verbatim from his email to me:

"The 1995 CDG Northern Sump Index does not say that the entrance has collapsed. What it actually states is:

"There is presently no access to this cave. The entrance is currently blocked and all negociations with the farmer to reopen it have failed."

The following is from memory since my logbooks do not seem contain the appropriate notes. The entrance rift was dug almost completely open some time in the early 1990s by myself and other divers / cavers based at Greenclose. Our intention was to redive the upstream sumps. I recall that the entrance rift was nearly clear into the streamway before we deemed it appropriate to request permission from the farmer. (I am stunned that we were not spotted beforehand since the entrance is so visible from both the road and the farmer's house.)

The farmer was furious (probably quite rightly) and permission was most definitely not forthcoming. I seem to recall we were almost forcibly escorted off his property. Some days later the entrance rift had been completely re-filled. Further (more polite) attempts to negociate some form of access failed dismally. We never returned. The cave remains inaccessible. And there aren't many other sites with such potential as this that have been left so untouched, for so long."

Back in the summer of 1980 I spent a couple of exciting hours re-opening this cave. Digging was relatively easy and was encouraged by a very strong outwards draught. The bottom of the entrance rift was rather loose and could have done with a bit of shoring but apart from that there was no real difficulty. Leaving my wife to stand guard on the surface I explored most of the passage this side of the sump, attempting to locate a possible bypass but with no success. However, there were several oxbows that I didn't check so it could be well worthwhile someone else having a look. Certainly, the passage beyond the sump sounds extremely promising to say the least. As the previous post points out, the entrance is in a very exposed position and it is difficult to keep a low profile, although we encountered no access problems as such - maybe it was Market Day! I must admit I am a little bit surprised that the CNCC have been unable to negotiate a better access solution to such a promising site after all this time.

Thanks for the update, NigR, Pitlamp, Langthwaite Pot & Simon.

The access problems sound intractable; however, it seems that things have stayed quiet for over a decade, and a careful approach to the farmer from CNCC might be the best way forward - on the basis of limited access for exploration only.

I strongly recommend against digging it out without permission and antagonising the farmer again.

What a pity that this superb, little cave with so much potential should be closed.  I went down not long after it was discovered (I think I might have helped survey some of it?) and remember some interesting green helictites. Wonder why the farmer is so adamant; I don?t recall having to cross any fences etc.  Maybe some digging further upstream might prove fruitful?? :-\

. . . in which case where is the survey published?

Pitlamp said:

. . . in which case where is the survey published?

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As I recall, ULSA REview 14 contains a description and survey as far as the upstream sump. I don't know if this publication is still available.

Ah - that's the one. I knew it was in one of those excellent journals. It's widely available in caving club libraries and many private collections.

Pitlamp said:

It's widely available in caving club libraries and many private collections.

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not exactly on Amazon then. 
Shelves have been delivered for the eldon library. Slowly slowly catchy monkey.

isn't it online then?  :-\

Bit off topic - but Feel free to come a scan it all if you like Graham. JB attempted to catalogue it before christmas - he listed ~6000 items in a spreadsheet, about half of what what there!!! - so if you have some spare time Graham feel free.

PS - the reason JB didn't finish the job was his flat was broken into and the laptop stolen. And no, he didn't have a backup. (non of the emoticons are anywhere near strong enough).

Sam, I didn't mean the Eldon library, I meant the ULSA Journal. I was responding to your comment about Amazon, not the one about the Eldon. It's not your responsibility to deal with everybody else's stuff, but a lot of clubs are getting their stuff up there. Most of the UBSS Proceedings back to the 1960s plus some older stuff is online as are all the Newsletters back to 1969. I am working on steadily filling the gaps. More stuff has been uploaded this morning. I also know the BEC have got all of theirs online.

But I agree, this is off topic.

And I agree with you about JB's laptop.

Just because I helped take a few measurements etc doesn't mean they were any good! or that anybody actually drew a survey. If so it would be in an old ULSA journal.

Bob G said:

Langthwaite Pot said:

According to the 1995 Northern Sump Index (post dating NC1), the entrance has collapsed and the farmer is not allowing access. 

Click to expand...

A genuine collapse seems unlikely; as I recall, it was a pretty solid rift from which a lot of rocks were removed - I would think it just got filled in again.

I guess nothing has changed since 1995?

Click to expand...

My apologies - I should have realised that 'blocked' and 'collapsed' are not the same thing!  :-[

George.

Has anyone been downstream in Spittle Croft? Most of the very powerful draft seems to go downstream in dry weather in Summer. At the onset of wet weather, the draft reverses and blows out of the entrance for a time, even when the Skirfare starts to flow into it.
From my (very old) memory of downstream Spittle Croft, the passage is wide, low and wet. After a couple of hundred feet, it ends in drafting rifts that would need to be dug to make further progress.
Spittle Croft cave is by no means the only potential point of entry to the huge system that probably exists beneath this bit of Littondale.
In the 1970's, someone had a dig just downstream of the bridge over the Skirfare on the Stainforth bridleway. To this day, a quick poke with a stick is enough to produce a spectacular whirlpool if the river is flowing, or a strong draft if it isn't. Unfortunately, this site, in common with several other sites along this stretch of river, suffer from similar access problems to Spittle Croft.
The hopeless looking Skirfare main sink, which lies just downstream of the bridge to Upper Hesleden Farm, is of interest as the cracks down which the water flows, draft strongly. Something open must lurk near the surface.
In Penyghent Gill, Waterfall Cave takes a strong draft and appears to be Going Places however, the solid floored passage becomes too low and would need major surgery. As this cave is home to bats, it should not be entered. Beneath Waterfall Cave is the scary and thankfully short Snurds Hole. Snurds, which ends in an underwater boulder choke, is far too small for the amount of water that it takes.
Potts Beck, above Litton Village, contains several sinks and Potts Beck Pot. At fist sight, Potts Beck appears to be another Ease Gill but most of the sinks, with the exception of Potts Beck Pot, are not well developed. As far as I know there are no access restrictions in Potts Beck or Penyghent Gill.
It's good to see that there is so much interest in this area. Happy digging.

I had a walk past Spittle Croft on Sunday, there was water in the beck and nice little plug hole type vortex over the blocked entrance. It was even making plug hole type noises.

It would be great if ULSA would allow their survey to be scanned and put it on the web. I'd love to see it overlaid on the satellite imagery on CaveMaps.org.

Dear ULSA,

Please, please, please let me scan your Spittle Croft Cave survey and put it on the CaveMaps.org website for everyone to enjoy. I'm sure it really would be much appreciated by a lot of people. It seems such a shame that a great piece of work that doubtless required lots of hours of voluntary work by numerous folks is not being seen by the new generation of like-minded cavers who might be inspired to take the work forward.

Yours optimistically

Cave Mapper

p.s. I emailed you before Christmas on a similar subject, but I didn't get a reply. Has your email address changed?

Cave Mapper said:

I had a walk past Spittle Croft on Sunday, there was water in the beck and nice little plug hole type vortex over the blocked entrance. It was even making plug hole type noises.

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Don't suppose you called at the farm and asked if you could re-open it, did you?

Regarding the ULSA survey, I would second your suggestion - it would be most interesting to see it.