BCA Youth and Development Report (for the meeting on the 6th of January)

nearlywhite

Active member
Youth and Development Report
6th January 2018

Context for UKC:

Previously the Youth and Development Officer role was a non voting member on council. There has always been some confusion as to what the exact nature of the role: this is due to the tendency for CHECC chairpeople in the past to assume both this role and that of the voting representative for CHECC.

Since I assumed this role 2 and a half years ago I've been treating it as an operational role for BCA i.e. picking up the pieces and plugging the holes left by CHECC and ASCT, and often filling in as CHECC delegate when they couldn't attend council. I've also used it to represent the interests at council despite not having vote.

At the last BCA AGM I criticised this set up. Mainly because as an operational role trying to do things solo is equivalent to urinating in the wind. I must say what was good about the role is it lent a heavy hitting authority with Universities and Unions when CHECC has had issues and allowed effective intervention. The BCA and a Youth and Development Working Group was suggested after I pointed out that more people needed to be involved - ?engaging with the membership? to use BCA buzzwords.

I should point out that I came under some (in my view unfair for a myriad of reasons) criticism on this forum for not submitting a report, not attending and not apologising for missing 1 quarterly meeting out of the 9 I've attended. However I was pleased that someone read the minutes and took the time to raise the issue of how effectively are trying to deal with Youth and Development - this led to me reflecting on the whole situation and to where we are now. Armchair caving on UKC does achieve things ;)


The last calendar year has seen big changes to youth and development with a working group set up following the AGM. Initially comprised of 5 members it has grown to 11. There?s participation from CHECC and the ASCT. Given its short history, few of the projects have come to fruition however it has had a noticeable improvement in communication and as a result members have a good working appreciation of CHECC, ASCT and the BCA.

Lancaster

Thanks to some keen grassroot cavers at Lancaster University, I am very happy to report that in the coming weeks they will be incorporated as an official club. The support provided from various members of the group included:
Writing a new constitution, risk assessments, good practice guidelines
Advice on union meetings/Insurance/funding
Providing kit, transport & trips (notably ULSA, Red Rose)
Training and general advice (CHECC)

It?s been an eye opening experience to see a club start from scratch and we are learning what the biggest stumbling blocks are. It?s not all what you would think: kit hasn?t been a major issue so far - by linking with other clubs that has got over that, for now. I think there is a role for a BCA funded kit lending set up for new clubs, however there are issues with maintenance and storage.

Undisclosed member of CHECC

Also of note I have been liaising with the guild of students on behalf of [redacted] over what has largely been an insurance issue: the guild were under the impression that LCLMAs are needed for student leaders and since none of the current crop of students have one caving has been suspended as they wouldn?t be insured (they are now BCA insured).

The working group has been involved in getting them to cave as part of other clubs so that they don?t deskill and also have been chasing the guild for a decision on the information provided (still outstanding). CHECC is changing the way it engages with these issues so that these things are being taken on by a single person and avoid the issues of plural responsibility that we have seen so far - this issue could have been avoided had CHECC or the BCA Y&D been involved 2 years ago, instead the issue had input from a regional council. I would strongly encourage any regional council to consult us before helping to provide training documentation.

Current projects and a brief progress statement:
Creation of the caving club starter pack:
Documentation pack is being tried and tested. We need to look at what other useful things we can bundle into this and in what form the BCA might be able to help with a kit lend scheme.

Mountaineering Caving Sections:
One of our members is currently doing some research as to how best approach mountaineers but is looking to getting caving sections established in mountaineering clubs. The intention is to use the BMC insurance coverage of occasional caving to allow them to ?dip their toes?. The issue is getting through to interested parties as this has been (unsuccessfully) attempted before.

Creation and expansion of scout caving teams:
ASCT is approaching other teams that go caving in scouting and are in the long process of becoming the official body of scout caving. We are discussing various schemes to get more leaders from student caving involved in scouts by streamlining the leader sign off process.

Under 18s caving as part of normal caving clubs:
Information campaign coming soon to an internet near you.

The creation of Karst Hydrology/Geochemistry, and Engineering groups in the model of the CHECC Biospeleology Group:

I?m happy to report that the CHECC Biospeleology Group has been incorporated as a BCRA special interest group, which gives them access to funding and stronger links with the BCRA. It's important to note it's not CHECC only, just that it has been set up as such. We have yet to recruit people in the other disciplines above who want to set these things up.

Student development handbook:
Assisting CHECC with its writing of the handbook. This has been on a back burner due to more pressing recent issues but is largely complete.

There are a number of other projects that we are working on but have yet to see a concrete plan or proposal put forward - this should be resolved by the next meeting.

Meeting member clubs
I'd also like to announce that we'd love to engage with our member clubs to how they can improve things if they are interested in what they can do for Youth and Development. The plan would be ideally having face to face meetings and tailoring a scheme to you - putting you in touch with the relevant contacts, help with running events, applying for funding from relevant sources and helping with unexpected problems.

Well done for getting to the end of that, I tried to make as brief and non waffley as I could.

Rostam.

 

damian

Active member
Very impressive, Rostam. You're juggling a lot of different projects - keep up the good work.
 

cap n chris

Well-known member
Something like this happening here would impress me:

https://ukcaving.com/board/index.php?topic=22967.msg289676#msg289676
 

nearlywhite

Active member
Cap'n Chris said:
Something like this happening here would impress me:

https://ukcaving.com/board/index.php?topic=22967.msg289676#msg289676

Presumably you are unimpressed by the rest of it? Oh well.

As we've previously discussed there are a myriad of reasons why this hasn't happened. I'll reiterate that we're quite busy with our current projects but would be able to provide support should anyone want to volunteer to run such an event.

So if there are any keen volunteers who'd like to get involved on a project like that - we'd love to have you in the youth and development working group. It turns out that Brits do run things like this as is mentioned in the correction I'm putting out below.

I'd also like to issue a correction regarding the BCRA and the CHECC Biospeleology group

There was an error in communication and they are not a special interest group - the BCRA advised that they should apply to become one and indicated that they would welcome such an application (this turns out not to have been made yet).

They are however working together closely and have weekends planned in South Wales and the Peak District to help train student speleologists covering areas such as cave biology, hydrology, and climate science.
 

cap n chris

Well-known member
nearlywhite said:
Presumably you are unimpressed by the rest of it?

Incorrect: the rest of it is impressive.

However, my personal focus is on BCA doing something/anything to scoop up and run with the interest that might be shown towards caving by the tens of thousands of under 18s who cave in the UK every year. Do any of them know BCA exists, does BCA send PDF/posters to all the HSE/AALS registered outdoor pursuits companies so they can put up info about the 'next step for an interested youngster', is there aspirational photography/info (e.g. number/length/size of caves in this country, details about how to get qualifications or experience etc. etc. and PLEASE SPARE me the usual trite platitudes about the best thing being to join a club - as has been proven time and again, for under 18s joining a club is probably not a useful move).

So, big up Rostam,  and well done squire,..... but under 18s still need work, I reckon. Youth, imo, should not be adults, ideally.
 

Badlad

Administrator
Staff member
Saturday's BCA council meeting were very impressed with the amount going on at Y&D.  Council offered encouragement and support for the effort being put in by the whole extended group and Rostam in particular of course.

Big up from me too  (y) (y) (y)
 

2xw

Active member
Cap'n Chris said:
nearlywhite said:
Presumably you are unimpressed by the rest of it?

Incorrect: the rest of it is impressive.

However, my personal focus is on BCA doing something/anything to scoop up and run with the interest that might be shown towards caving by the tens of thousands of under 18s who cave in the UK every year. Do any of them know BCA exists, does BCA send PDF/posters to all the HSE/AALS registered outdoor pursuits companies so they can put up info about the 'next step for an interested youngster', is there aspirational photography/info (e.g. number/length/size of caves in this country, details about how to get qualifications or experience etc. etc. and PLEASE SPARE me the usual trite platitudes about the best thing being to join a club - as has been proven time and again, for under 18s joining a club is probably not a useful move).

So, big up Rostam,  and well done squire,..... but under 18s still need work, I reckon. Youth, imo, should not be adults, ideally.

Wind your neck in. We're getting it done.

Unfortunately we all have full time jobs and families. Many of the Y&D group are students, wonder what they're normally doing in January... I'm sure you'll accept our humblest apologies.
 

nearlywhite

Active member
'Incorrect: the rest of it is impressive.' Perhaps revise your writing style if it's not conveying the meaning you intend?

'However, my personal focus is on BCA doing something/anything to scoop up and run with the interest that might be shown towards caving by the tens of thousands of under 18s who cave in the UK every year.' Something/anything? Starting to think my first comment a tad redundant. I think we do, perhaps reread my report?

Do any of them know BCA exists, does BCA send PDF/posters to all the HSE/AALS registered outdoor pursuits companies so they can put up info about the 'next step for an interested youngster',' They probably don't but that's because advertising with posters about a administrative body of a sport has a fairly limited effect on uptake as has been proven for years - the BCA has been doing this. There have been many versions of this - notably trycaving. We are (as written in the report) working on a new information campaign.

'is there aspirational photography/info (e.g. number/length/size of caves in this country, details about how to get qualifications or experience etc. etc.' Yes, there is a wonderful website, it's called https://newtocaving.com/ - it was created by some wonderful people on this forum. Please spread the word. They've even agreed to look into a testimonial from parents section!

and PLEASE SPARE me the usual trite platitudes about the best thing being to join a club - as has been proven time and again, for under 18s joining a club is probably not a useful move).

No.

You constantly bang on about one issue and don't listen to what I've advocated for so why would I heed this facile and inane request when you don't take your own advice? See, it's not very nice is it? They aren't platitudes - the fact that it isn't currently a useful move is PRECISELY the reason we need to help our clubs - get them starting scout sections, helping them with child protection concerns, queries about insurance, pitching things at the right level, how to talk to parents, providing them with material about caving and how to show their community that it is possible.We have pockets of excellent practice and I go around and talk to people in other clubs who would like to do things like that but don't want all the trouble being a pioneer gets you. We need to talk about this more. Sorry.

All of the above isn't a platitude. What would be a platitude would be 'the BCA should get under 18s caving'. We. All. Agree. The question is 'how?'. Like it or not the units that recruit people into the sport are our clubs - you talk to a new caver for the first time you get asked 'what club are you from?'. It makes sense to start with clubs and help them become places that under 18s can join.

So, big up Rostam,  and well done squire,..... but under 18s still need work, I reckon. Youth, imo, should not be adults, ideally. And people who want to do something for youth caving should stand up and be counted, I've offered you enough plinths.
 

andrewmcleod

Well-known member
nearlywhite said:
All of the above isn't a platitude. What would be a platitude would be 'the BCA should get under 18s caving'. We. All. Agree. The question is 'how?'. Like it or not the units that recruit people into the sport are our clubs - you talk to a new caver for the first time you get asked 'what club are you from?'. It makes sense to start with clubs and help them become places that under 18s can join.

In most sports it is still through clubs that the majority of kids get into sport. Admittedly the clubs are very different beasts to the social/drinking establishments that some (not all) caving clubs are, with some clubs only existing for the kids and the others being much more set up for kids in terms of child protection, activities and coaching, but clubs remain the major entry points to most sports at all ages.
 

ali_mac

Member
I started caving at age 21/22, I'm 28 now.

I started caving after becoming interested in mines from an "urban exploration" background, although I ended up joining my small local caving club and not going in any mines!  I am the youngest club member by some 18 years.

My nearest caves are 2 hours away.

I certainly wouldn't have been able to start caving without a club.  They meet at the pub once a week, discuss trips, the outdoors and have a beer.  The club still e-mails through its website from people asking to try caving.  We take them on "beginners" trips and have a retention of around 1 in 4.  That translates to perhaps 2 new members in my 6/7 years in the club.  In that period, we have lost 2 members due to deaths and many more who are backing off due to old age.  I'm the youngest member by almost 20 years. 

Clubs are an important way of gaining access to caves.  There are plenty of caves which require training and tackle to access and a club is a brilliant way of learning from your elders and accessing that equipment, often for an extremely reasonable annual sub, and a usage fee of a couple of quid. 
There is no way I could have visited many of the caves I have, without a club.  Either because I would have lacked the contacts for leader caves like Upper Flood or finances to fund SRT kits, ladders or other tackle, or as a way of learning about conservation, risk, safety and teamwork. 

In my mind, clubs are an incredibly important part of the caving scene in the UK, both from a technical and social perspective and new cavers should be encouraged to join clubs. We should be encouraging new cavers to join clubs wherever we can!
 

Tommy

Active member
Urbex, now there's an avenue we don't seem to tap into that much, unless I'm just unaware.

I know the C9C guys will go anywhere though...

Perhaps a 'Go Wild' poster campaign with posters left behind in abandoned warehouses and the such.

I'd imagine plenty of ne'er do well city kids still like launching fireworks down disused rail tunnels.

Apologies if tangential.
 

Cookie

New member
ali_mac said:
In my mind, clubs are an incredibly important part of the caving scene in the UK, both from a technical and social perspective and new cavers should be encouraged to join clubs. We should be encouraging new cavers to join clubs wherever we can!

Here, here. Well said.

Clubs* are at the forefront of creating and sustaining cavers. BCA should be doing everything it can to support the clubs.  As the BCA Constitution says "4.8. That caving is an activity best pursued in a club environment and that the Association recommends individuals be members of a club. "

* I include the caving youth organisations as clubs.

There are thousands of individuals per year who try caving in the commercial sector. One of the best ways BCA could support clubs and caving is to find ways of improving the conversion rate of those individuals into club members.

 
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