I?ve heard said that the Cripple Creek route into Ireby II is unlikely to get much traffic, especially now the Whirlpool Passage route has broken through. I beg to differ.

I completed the round trip on Friday ? in through Whirlpool and out by Cripple Creek ? and it is a superb trip, one of the best in the Dales. Yes, it?s got a long flat-out crawl and some squeezes, and there?s some route finding challenges, but isn?t that what caving is about?

For me, it was a six hour trip, including an excursion into Frink Chamber and beyond (I accidentally climbed four pitches instead of three). A fit party with knowledge of the route would be able to do it faster, but another party who did it on the same day as me in the opposite direction took about nine hours.

My trip was possibly the first unguided trip through Cripple Creek, but with careful study of the surveys, the route finding is not that bad (I just made the one mistake). I can?t think of anything else in the Dales that is similar: it?s a big round trip, with no escape options. In some ways it?s a bit like Dowbergill Passage but with much more variety and about 1.5 times as hard. If you like Dowbergill, you?ll love this one.

I would recommend a recce into both ends prior to going for the through trip. Ideally, you should at least check out the climb up into the Glory Holes passage and from the other end go as far as Jupiter Cavern.

A big thanks to all the diggers for creating this fantastic addition to Northern caving?s repertoire.

I'm glad you enjoyed the trip - it certainly has all the making of a classic. A less well publicised, but equally fine new outing is the 'Greater Barbondale Traverse'. This starts at Crystal Cave and goes through the upstream ducks to enter Dog Holes at Monsoon Chamber. The streamway is followed downsteram to the end of South Passage where there is an obscure connection down through boulders into the recently discovered 'Bucket on the Head'. Some large dry passage is followed by a cracking streamway with 5 ducks to exit from Bucket on the Head in the gill bed. Wetsuit reccommended! The trip is about 1.5km and takes about 2 hours if you know the way, but probably 3-5hrs if you don't.

George.

George - out of interest what's the grid ref of B.O.T.H?

B.O.T.H. can be found at SD 66518350

regards
Beardy

Not done Cripple Creek/Skylight yet but looking forward to it at some point in the future, certainly sounds like a classic trip!

Not done the Barbon traverse either, but have had a pleasant trip downstream in BOTH, which makes for a relatively dry and short/quick trip if you're lacking in the time department..

This starts at Crystal Cave and goes through the upstream ducks to enter Dog Holes at Monsoon Chamber

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How bad is that route, I've heard rumours about it being very tight? (The NFTFH feedback page suggests average sized cavers may struggle to get through... )

Hi Dunc,
There are two connections Barker's Passage (Crystal Cave) to Hey's Passage (Dog Hole), refered to as tight on NFTFH website and in Northern Caves. The second route is through the upstream end of Crystal Cave to Monsoon Chamber (Dog Hole).

Sam

We did a variation on the Ireby round-trip on 3rd may last year.
In via ding dong bell etc. pumped the sump dry, did quite a few hours digging in skylight and then went out via cripple creek and bubbles. No survey available then and none of us had done it before. We were given the helpful route finding tip that 'if it isn't squalid and tight you've gone wrong'. Working title for this variation was 'figure of hate'. 

Ahh.. cheers for clearing that up Sam

georgenorth said:

A less well publicised, but equally fine new outing is the 'Greater Barbondale Traverse'.

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I've already got my sights set on on that one, or at least the Dog Holes to BOTH section. Am I right in thinking that the newer Crystal Cave to Dog Holes connection needs near draught conditions, because it's sumped most of the time?

Where does the connection from Dog Holes to BOTH go? I had a trip into Dog Holes recently and near the end of the cave I noticed a traverse rope going over a drop and into a side passage, is that the route?

Has anyone done a survey yet?

Yes - the second route through the upstream end of Crystal Cave to Monsoon Chamber (Dog Hole) does need dry weather.

Connection is about 50m back from the Dog Hole sump - its a passage on the true left of the passage.

Yes it has been surveyed - and will be published hopefully as a large sheet along with the forthcoming RRCPC Journal later this year (I promise).

Regards
Beardy     

Cheers for the info - one other question; does the water disappearing into Dog Hole's downstream sump reappear in your more recent discoveries? (Just asking as an aid to ongoing sump index work.) Thanks.

Quote"does the water disappearing into Dog Hole's downstream sump reappear in your more recent discoveries?"

almost cetainly - no test has been done but the two sumps are very close

regards
Beardy 

Is this trip tight ie would a 59 year 14 stone experienced caver manage? I like the sound of the Crystal Cave trip. I have a rather crap b/w photo taken in there when I was 16 or 17 (of a duck) and always wondered if anything came of the cave. Sounds like a collector's item and as I have done some Northern trips this past year and plan more was intrigued.

Depends on which trip you refer to as being tight?
Cripple creek should be do-able with your given dimensions (assuming you're not 5ft tall in which case girth may be an issue).
Have done the trip with someone of similar stature. As long as you go in via cripple creek, the crux squeeze will be downhill and will have the advantage of gravitational assistance. It's more of a psychological problem to get past through the squeeze - it's no place to get the wobblys.
As for age, I've also had the pleasure of doing the trip with a 67 year old stalwart, although he was from the eldon and therefore of a different breed to mere humans.
If it's B.O.T.H. you're refering to, the connecting streamway does have a number of entertaining squeeze/ducks and if the water is moderately high, it will feel as commiting as cripple creek.
Have a long weekend and do both?

Hi MRODoc,

I'd say you should get through the upstream connection between Crystal Cave and Dog Holes with a bit of cobble moving (we had to do this anyway). I'd say you'd be unlikely to get through the squeezes in South Passage and the connection to BOTH though. I'm not sure about the route through 'The Jungle' to exit via Dog Holes I'm afraid - I haven't done all of it, although from what I've seen it is very complex! BOTH is a cracking find and well worth a trip in its own right.

The connection squeeze in Cripple Creek is now much larger than it was - the trip is sustained and awkward rather than tight.

George.

The Crystal Bucket trip is sounding more and more interesting. How many times has it been done so far?

The 'Jungle' in Dog Holes is not as bad as the guidebook makes it sound, but it is probably worth checking out prior to attempting a through trip, because it is the escape route if the connection to Crystal Cave is not passable. On my Dog Holes trip, the section that gave me difficulty was the low wet section half way along South Passage. It was silted up with shingle to the point where I couldn't fit through. I had to dig it out with one hand while lying in water in a flat out sqeeze. It was quite a struggle, and that was after a spell of dry weather.

Are there any pitches in BOTH?

Are there any pitches in BOTH?

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There is one if you do the downstream bit of BOTH, not sure of the length if you rig it dry - no more than 10m is what someone told me (although we found it's a bit over 10m if you rig it in the water : ).

There's an 10m (ish) pitch in the downstream passage beyond 'The Spanish Inquisition' chamber in BOTH. You don't need to go down it to do the through trip - only if you want to visit the sump. I'd be very, very surprised if the Crystal-Bucket trip has been done more than once - I'm not sure if the Dog-Bucket traverse has been repeated either. Barkers Passage which is the original connection between Crystal Cave and Dog Holes is indeed tight. The upstream route is both much easier and more interesting. We did it last Summer when the water levels weren't particularly low so I reckon some cobbles must have shifted since NC3 was published.

Enjoy!