Removable bolts from Petzl

Bob Mehew

Well-known member
I see they are made to EN795 which has slightly lower strength requirements than mountaineering anchors made to EN959.  That is because EN795 anchors are subject to routine testing where as EN959 anchors are not.  I expect when they announce the details it will include testing to 6kN on installation as per BS 7883, the CoP for EN795 anchors.
 

Mark Wright

Active member
Bob Mehew said:
I see they are made to EN795 which has slightly lower strength requirements than mountaineering anchors made to EN959.  That is because EN795 anchors are subject to routine testing where as EN959 anchors are not.  I expect when they announce the details it will include testing to 6kN on installation as per BS 7883, the CoP for EN795 anchors.

We had this discussion before.

The reason why EN959 anchors have to be stronger than EN795 anchors is because they are likely to be subjected to considerably higher forces in use. A maximum of 12kN for EN959 anchors as opposed to a maximum of 6kN for EN795 anchors.

According to Petzl the new anchors should be available in July.

Mark 
 

Madness

New member
Petzl claim it can be installed without tools.

Have they not overlooked the fact that you need to drill a hole first?

And what when that hole has worn from putting them in and taking them out?

They seem a little pointless to me for caving applications
 

MarkS

Moderator
Madness said:
Petzl claim it can be installed without tools.

Have they not overlooked the fact that you need to drill a hole first?

And what when that hole has worn from putting them in and taking them out?

They seem a little pointless to me for caving applications

I would assume Petzl mean they don't require a spanner/hammer/driver/setting-tool etc. I could see them potentially being great for bolt climbing, but I wonder what the price will be like...
 

Mattrees

Member
MarkS said:
I would assume Petzl mean they don't require a spanner/hammer/driver/setting-tool etc. I could see them potentially being great for bolt climbing, but I wonder what the price will be like...

Thunderbolts/multi-montis cost about 50p each, I'll lend you a spanner if you like.  :)

Some removable bolts have issues with mud/dirt/water, which are not infrequent in caves (!) will be interesting to see how the Petzl design copes.
 

Mark Wright

Active member
One of the problems building owners have is that when, e.g. 100 permanent anchors are installed on a building, the building owner becomes responsible for their regular inspection. Every 12 months for fall arrest or work restraint purposes and every 6 months if they are used for rope access work. This can become quite expensive. I've been doing 6 monthly examinations on permanently installed anchors on a building in Sheffield for the past 5 years and they've never been used in all that time.

Removable Petzl anchors will save industry an absolute fortune. Unfortunately it is those who usually carry out the examinations that will lose out. Such is life.

Mark 
 

SamT

Moderator
Madness said:
They seem a little pointless to me for caving applications

this ^^^

Though I'm not sure anyone is actually suggesting they are going to be of any significance for caving applications...

Interesting development though...
 

Madness

New member
I assume that the information sheet that will come with the anchor will specify a minimum and maximum hole size for use with the anchor.

Drilling an accurately sized hole is very much dependent on various factors, such as the material you're drilling, condition of drill bit, play in the SDS chuck.

If a building is drilled for these anchors, whose to say that the placements will stay secure after multiple uses?
Will each hole need to be measured before subsequent installations of the anchor?

It looks an interesting bit of kit though.
 
Madness said:
I assume that the information sheet that will come with the anchor will specify a minimum and maximum hole size for use with the anchor.

Drilling an accurately sized hole is very much dependent on various factors, such as the material you're drilling, condition of drill bit, play in the SDS chuck.

If a building is drilled for these anchors, whose to say that the placements will stay secure after multiple uses?
Will each hole need to be measured before subsequent installations of the anchor?

It looks an interesting bit of kit though.

The whole thing being the variability of rock. It appears that we have lulled ourselves into a false sense of security with our self-congratulatory bolting expertise.

At least it's something for the BCA to make a fuss about and perhaps have a meeting about a meeting.
 

MarkS

Moderator
SamT said:
Madness said:
They seem a little pointless to me for caving applications

this ^^^

Though I'm not sure anyone is actually suggesting they are going to be of any significance for caving applications...

According to the Petzl page for the 8 mm version, it's "designed for caving"...
 

mikem

Well-known member
I meant at the end of that part of the exploration, rather than every use - it depends on the economics of being able to use them again elsewhere, compared to leaving a cheaper anchor.
 

Leclused

Active member
Perhaps Ukforum can ask Petzl some sample boxes that then can be lent out to expeditions for cave testing :)

Just an idea
 
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