I run the facebook page of UKC.  I'd prefer we didn't need to, however there is no denying the number of cavers who post on FB - so if you can't beat them....  It helps draw folks to the forum 

With apologies to those who don't use facebook...

I am constantly bombarded with messages and e-mails from facebook enticing me to 'boost posts' - 'reach 1000 more people for just ?2'. 'Here's a ?30 credit' blah blah.  The frequency of these posts is, I'm sure, increasing and at the same time the number of people 'reached' (i.e. if I post something, how many folks see it) is definitely decreasing.  The cynic in me thinks fb are holding back sharing UKC's FB posts around hoping we'll start to pay.

We have no plans to pay to boost posts on facebook for UKC.  We may, repeat may do so for New to Caving as that's helping to spread the word to a new audience hopefully - however not what I want to discuss here.

So my question is - if you run a fb page have you seen reach decline and requests for boosting increase??

UKC - run by cavers for cavers on a not for profit basis, with information saved and easy to search for future reference.  Facebook - run by billionaires who don't give a stuff about caves, caving or cavers.  So thank you to all those who contribute here and not just on the dubious social media giant 

If you're on facebook and have liked our FB page, please 'like' or 'share' a post or two - it really does help, cheers. Pegasus.

This decline in organic reach has been happening for a long while.

Facebook have attributed this to (see here):
- Competition: as more people post more content to facebook, your posts get viewed less
- More ads: as more adverts are added to the site there is less space for suggested content that hasn't been paid for
- News feed changes: facebook has decided that it wants to encourage interpersonal communication, so posts by pages are not a priority on people's news feeds.

From the pages I run, I've definitely seen lots more promotion to boost posts.

I run a 10k group and there is definitely more bloody advertising now to boost the fing thing

I run a small page for a local nature reserve (350 followers) and am an admin for a local neighbourhood forum with about 2000 followers. Since I became admin for the larger group, all FB's badgering has been in respect to that and I haven't had any "boost your post" or "your followers haven't heard from you" posts from the smaller page except for the irritating regular "suggested slideshow".

I don't get emails for either, just posts to the page. So it looks like you can turn off emails for the marketing stuff.

Haven't noticed a decrease in "reach" - maybe we're too small to bother about?

As a recipient, actual interaction with a page or group seems to be necessary to see the group in your newsfeed. Mere "liking" the group is no longer enough, you have to either "follow" it or at the very least start to "like" individual posts - better still, comment on them.

Seems that the way they measure reach has also changed, so the percentage seeing it hasn't necessarily dropped as much as the numbers suggest - hopefully the latest figures are more realistic, but it's still a difficult to define quantity...

You do seem to have more follows than likes!

Mike

Facebook makes Satan look like Mother Theresa.  Read an article recently and in the comments section someone posted a list of what FaceBook likes to potentially access / harvest given the chance:

"This app has access to:

Device & app history: retrieve running apps

Identity: find accounts on the device, add or remove accounts. read your own contact card

Calendar: read calendar events plus confidential information, add or modify calendar events and send email to guests without owners' knowledge

Contacts: find accounts on the device, read your contacts, modify your contacts

Location: approximate location (network-based), precise location (GPS and network-based)

SMS: read your text messages (SMS or MMS)

Phone: read phone status and identity

Photos / Media / Files: read the contents of your USB storage, modify or delete the contents of your USB storage

Storage: read the contents of your USB storage, modify or delete the contents of your USB storage

Camera:take pictures and videos

Microphone: record audio

Wi-Fi connection information: view Wi-Fi connections

Device ID & call information: read phone status and identity

Phone: directly call phone numbers, read phone status and identity

Phone: read call log, read phone status and identity, write call log

Identity: find accounts on the device

Contacts: find accounts on the device

Identity: find accounts on the device, add or remove accounts

Other: download files without notification, receive data from Internet, adjust your wallpaper size, view network connections, create accounts and set passwords, read battery statistics, pair with Bluetooth devices, access Bluetooth settings, send sticky broadcast, change network connectivity, connect and disconnect from Wi-Fi, full network access, change your audio settings, read sync settings, run at startup, draw over other apps, control vibration, prevent device from sleeping, modify system settings, toggle sync on and off, install shortcuts, read Google service configuration,

change network connectivity, reorder running apps, set wallpaper"

https://forums.theregister.co.uk/forum/2/2018/05/18/facebook_android_app_caught_seeking_superuser_clearance/

So yes, if you Facebook or similar, you are the product!
They even harvest data if you don't have an account with them.  GDPR is a good thing if can regulate alleged shysters such as FaceBook etc.

That's fair enough Zombie, but most apps on your phone will have similar lists of permissions, and that list doesn't mean Facebook is intrinsically bad - in fact, it needs most of those permissions to function properly on your device.

Simply by having a smart phone you consent to these sorts of invasions of your privacy - as an android user, all of your data is available for download. I downloaded my own location data from my google account, and it had measured my physical location as a set of coordinates over 800,000 times in the last couple of years - on some days it had noted my location over 4000 times.

But this is just the world we live in - even without Facebook or a smart phone, your location is noted whenever you drive (ANPR on motorways for example) and your face is recorded wherever you walk (CCTV everywhere) your debit and credit card transaction history is monitored 24/7, you create data simply by doing stuff in your own home.

kay said:

I run a small page for a local nature reserve (350 followers) and am an admin for a local

As a recipient, actual interaction with a page or group seems to be necessary to see the group in your newsfeed. Mere "liking" the group is no longer enough, you have to either "follow" it or at the very least start to "like" individual posts - better still, comment on them.

Click to expand...

It no longer seems possible to view stuff in date order as opposed to how FB wants to present it to you when using a phone or tablet (or at least I can no longer do so) it is still possible from a proper 'sit down at a desk' computer, and the resulting stuff you see is very different in my experience.

...that list doesn't mean Facebook is intrinsically bad - in fact, it needs most of those permissions to function properly on your device.

Click to expand...

True, the theoretical or actual capability to do something isn't necessarily intrinsically bad in itself, although one could question why they really need all that stuff.
The badness arises from what a person or organisation actually does with that capability to exploit it, how far they go, whether they can really be trusted, and what level of moral compass (if any) they may have.

I think we need a lot of social change, one that favours the many not the few. I also think that its in our own hands, but do we have the will?