My current harness is wearing a bit thin so looking for a new one. Now I'm extremely unlikely to move away from a trusted Superavanti, but thought i'd have a look at the market anyway. I hadn't noticed this before. Looks very comfortable and i like the extra gear loops (although i note the new Superavanti now sports a couple more). At 465g is not much heavier than a Superavanti at 410g, but it looks like it will be bulkier. Has anyone tried one?

Haven't tried one but good to see that Petzl are adding more gear loops to their harnesses. For any kind of deep exploratory caving more gear loops are extremely helpful. Also for canyoning. I assume this harness is retailing for quite a bit more than a superavanti. Also I notice that Petzl have finally got around to making a useable chest harness for deep caving, called the 'explo'. Still looks far inferior to the expensive MTDE one...

Not that is relevant but the colour is mega!!!

?115 quid seems a smidge pricey to me though. I've got an AV Technibat and it was sub ?70 and super comfy.

I've been using a MTDE Picos for the last few years and have a brand-new one waiting in the wings - it's very comfy ands has plenty of loops - and for the price of that Petzl one you can get the posh MTDE chest harness too which has even more gear loops. The Picos is undoubtedly heavier and bulkier than the Super Avanti, but for long SRT trips or bolting it's a dream. I do still use the Super Avanti for really tight trips or where I need weight to be the absolute minimum, but it's a lot rarer.

Although that Petzl harness looks good enough for me to consider it coming back into the fold, I think I'll stick to the Alp Design Avalon for now. I'm currently on #3, which is more a reflection of me giving them a thrashing and mileage than fast wear. It's invariably the central D attachment points that end up being my reason for retirement.
The gear loops look quite flimsy, but I've never had one fail or come close to failing. The height adjustment straps at the back are better of sown at whatever happens to be your desired length, otherwise they're prone to becoming disattached (no safety concern, but annoying).

Supposedly only weights 350g, only 2 gear loops though. Extremely comfortable, and at around ?80 no too expensive.

The use of dynema/HDPE for the maillon to waist and leg loops attachment looks a good idea. Saves a lot of space on the maillon for clanky bits and doesn't need the extra wear protection layer the super Avanti now has. Would be a good upgrade for the next revision of the Avanti, if it suits the design. HDPE seems to be incredibly wear resistant. Foot loops of dyneema cord last ages. I've not had a gear loop fail on a Super Avanti since they changed from nylon webbing in the nineties. Back then, I'd only risk clipping a tackle bag to a gear loop on a brand new harness after seeing a full bag disappear back down a big pitch I'd just derigged!
Must admit I've stuck with the Avanti range since the days they were made in 25mm tape. I still consider the 25mm Avanti the best caving harness I ever had. I understand why they had to go to wider tape, but it made it much less accommodating to caving acrobatics.
My only complaint with the Super Avanti is that the sizing doesn't work for me. According to Petzl, I should use a size 1. If I do, there is only a scarily short length of tape protruding through the leg loop buckles. With a size 2, I end up with miles of excess tape coming out of the waist buckle. Other than that, they suit me fine, including carrying multiple tackle sacks and hanging around bolting for ages. Not seen a need to look elsewhere. Everything else on the market just seems to have too much stuff to snag on and weigh you down. Been lucky with my spine so far, so not felt the need for extra padding, The Aven is unlikely to be on my shopping list, but it looks a good design that will suit a lot of people.
Jen

The high attachment point looks a bit dubious.

The Avanti was indeed the best harness I ever had and has never properly been replaced. I would happily use one now as a light harness. We still use the Superavanti a lot, but after some trials I found the MTDE Picos to very efficient, and the newer Amazonia2 to be pretty good and less bulky (so I suppose that is the Avanti replacement). Also much cheaper than the Aven. It also spreads the load better on the back of my leg. The only issue with these harnesses is you have to slacken off the bum strap a bit for hiking and sometimes for wide straddles (it works fine completely loose anyway).
I was surprised how much using the Garma chest harness improved things, both for prussiking and carrying/rigging. Had never really considered it in the past. I suppose it?s a bit like having a roller box. My wife still uses the Petzl chest harness she bought in 1986, going to last a lifetime it seems. They don?t make them like they used to etc.

I notice the superavanti is also now orange. That?s dashing.

The Garma is a wonderful chest harness and spreads the load better for me - I fitted an additional back-strap to connect it to the sit harness. I have a Corde Courant 'Moka' krab upside-down as the central connector and I can hang my drill from that if I have to - it's perfect. The Petzl one was just too short, and cut grooves in my shoulders until I extended it with two maillons - which then smashed a hole in my back when I hit a wall.
Eventually I ripped the chest ascender strap off from overuse, but Tony S kindly sewed it back on for me with his heavy-duty stitching, so now I have two  :bow:

wellyjen:

With a size 2, I end up with miles of excess tape coming out of the waist buckle.

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A hot knife would soon sort out that little problem.

Thanks for the comments, and suggestions. The Aven seems less bulky & lighter than all the alternatives mentions, which is positive.

I am now only really worried about the potentially higher attachment point (compared to the Superavanti, which is maybe the lowest available, or maybe the Avalon?) so am still really keen to hear from anyone who has tried one on. Although i do realise the caving harness market is probably very slow right now...!

I suspect the benefit of a low attachment are over-rated, and many cavers would probably be better to cut back on the pies, lose some weight and do some exercise (myself included)... It would also be interesting to see how many cavers are actually taking large steps, and whether lifting the ascender up is actually a significant factor (higher attachment point = higher position of hand ascender for same stroke length).

A higher attachment point will make sitting up easier and for some body shapes that's probably a lot more useful than marginal efficiency gains (without messing around with chest pulleys etc).

BUT - if the higher attachment point is free to move because the harness is effectively hanging off the attachment point, like in this one, then it doesn't actually matter and the only difference is the potentially reduced prussiking stroke. The effective attachment point of a harness is really the height at which it provides support to the back (in terms of how you hang), rather than where the carabiner itself is. That's before considering the effect of the chest harness, of course.

Look interesting though. It's good that Petzl are still knocking out new kit which can only be for caving and associated sports (like this harness/chest harness, 8mm Pulse, the new Stop) and have no use in rope access etc; there can't be much money in it compared to the professional rope industry side.

andrewmc said:

I suspect the benefit of a low attachment are over-rated, and many cavers would probably be better to cut back on the pies, lose some weight and do some exercise (myself included)... It would also be interesting to see how many cavers are actually taking large steps, and whether lifting the ascender up is actually a significant factor (higher attachment point = higher position of hand ascender for same stroke length).

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Get your hands off my pies!

I imagine you?re right though. In an ideal situation the attachment point would be lower, but increased leg/hip flexibility would counteract a marginally higher central attachment point

Also if rope-walking, the height of the attachment point is less important, or arguably could be higher, as you shouldn't really be sitting down at all, and the chest ascender is essentially just an 'instant backup' should you need to take a rest. Granted this is a lot easier in a narrow pitch, but ideally all your weight should be alternately on your footloop or the foot ascender - and your spare hand, which does do a lot of the work for me. Two hand jammers might help, but would probably bang into each other a lot.

Ironically I find rope-access models very good for rope-walking as the attachment point is higher. I remember working in a narrow 'rift' between two buildings at Heathrow, probably about the same width as Bitch Pitch in JH, putting edging strips on cladding, and me and my mate  had to climb past each other to pass up these 4m strips. He didn't like it at all due to the confined space, and it was all polished aluminium. I'd sneakily put my Pantin on, and rope-walked past him at a good speed - he nearly fainted, as he'd never seen one before. I let him have a go later and he was really impressed - but I use one regularly for long static jobs as you can stand on it and take the weight of your arse for a bit. Anyway, I'm digressing again...

Dear Petzl technical support,
My caving harness has shrunk during lock down. Is it still safe to use? Why has this happened? Does the new Aven harness suffer from this problem? 

wellyjen said:

Dear Petzl technical support,
My caving harness has shrunk during lock down. Is it still safe to use? Why has this happened? Does the new Aven harness suffer from this problem? 

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Funnily enough I had the exact same issue today down Eldon Hole. Not just my harness, but my under suit and over suit had shrunk as well but only around my middle.

Why has this happened?

Mark

Mark Wright said:

wellyjen said:

Dear Petzl technical support,
My caving harness has shrunk during lock down. Is it still safe to use? Why has this happened? Does the new Aven harness suffer from this problem? 

Click to expand...

Funnily enough I had the exact same issue today down Eldon Hole. Not just my harness, but my under suit and over suit had shrunk as well but only around my middle.

Why has this happened?

Mark

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A side effect of the Jab perhaps? Everyone panic!