How high (and long) is the entrance squeeze in Daren Cilau??  I did it back in the early 90s, but time has made me question its dimensions... a little like a big fish story.

CN.

If by "entrance squeeze" you mean the initial few metres of the cave, then it's about 2 body lengths and is tight enough that whatever's in your oversuit pocket is pushed into your chest ... but it's the sort of thing most people fit through without too much hassle.

If you mean the "vice" a bit further into the entrance "crawl", then it's similar dimensions but on its side (it's a rift).

Does that help?

And there is a square-like small bit near the far end that would be awkward if you had big shoulders - or big anything really. It looks just like someone's avatar on this forum, but I can't remember who it is.

If you were there in the early days, you'll remember that right on the surface was a tight diagonal squeeze past a boulder/flake. That was remove some years ago (allowing the water in the entrance to freeze faster no doubt!)  :-\

I never found the vice to be a problem - having long legs, I found the S and Z bends to be more fun (I found cross legged to be best!) The T-slot and trickle-in-the-ear have got considerably bigger over the years - I know that I have and I still fitted a couple of years ago!

Also your oversuit should survive the trip these days, there's not too much sharp stuff in there now - I did the crawl in a wetsuit before the first breakthroughs and it was in shreds, as was I, when I got out.  :-[

I always had a sore left hip after doing the crawl (more of a sideways thrutch) in an oversuit, logging up more that 40 trips in the 3 years after the breakthrough. A few years ago it was X-ray'd and looked like crazy pavement with all the evidence of stress fractures  :blink:


Looking at your avatar, and having read about other trips that you have done, you'll have no problems.

Thanks for all the comments... I went on a trip to the Antlers in the early nineties so I have been through the entrance series.  I remember doing the initial entrance squeeze with no problem, apart from it being a little daunting... I like to transition into squeezes.  Squeezes at entrances are, in my opinion, intimidating.  I was just wondering what the actual height of it is... I remember it as being 20cm high... am I right or is it less than that?

Memories fade over time... I have always wanted to see the Time Machine with my own eyes.

CN.

What's 20cm translated into English - about 8 inches?

I would say its considerably taller than this (maybe 12-14 inches), but it would be much reduced if the puddle freezes.

Being quite broad shouldered, I find the "calcite squeezes" towards the inner end the most awkward - half face submerged and flap like a fish out of water!

I also agree with Dave H, that it can seriously damage your hip / ribs / elbows, thrutching along on the same side for a couple of thousand feet. I used to go in on my right, and come out on my left.

I was on a trip through the entrance crawl with a couple of others, and we were taking it easy as there was no ruch when a party of divers including Ian Rolland came up at a fast pace behind us. As we were at a section where I was able to lay completely flat out they were able to crawl past over me!

We exited the cave later, went to the pub in Crickhowll, went to bed, got up again next morning and as we were eating breakfast, the party of divers arrived back at Whitewalls after a LONG trip looking like death warmed up!

spikey said:

What's 20cm translated into English - about 8 inches?

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I was talking English units... the Americans have yet to grasp the metric system...  you are dating yourself Mr. Spikey  :.  You really think it is 12 - 14 inches (30.48cm - 35.56cm)... wow... my memory has suffered!!

CN.

Cumbrian Neil said:

spikey said:

What's 20cm translated into English - about 8 inches?

Click to expand...

I was talking English units... the Americans have yet to grasp the metric system...  you are dating yourself Mr. Spikey  :.  You really think it is 12 - 14 inches (30.48cm - 35.56cm)... wow... my memory has suffered!!

CN.

Click to expand...

A fat bastard can easily fit through a squeeze that a well muscled bastard can't. Speaking from experience and with no knowledge of what the natural ageing process has so far done to Neil

emgee said:

Cumbrian Neil said:

spikey said:

What's 20cm translated into English - about 8 inches?

Click to expand...

I was talking English units... the Americans have yet to grasp the metric system...  you are dating yourself Mr. Spikey  :.  You really think it is 12 - 14 inches (30.48cm - 35.56cm)... wow... my memory has suffered!!

CN.

Click to expand...

A fat bastard can easily fit through a squeeze that a well muscled bastard can't. Speaking from experience and with no knowledge of what the natural ageing process has so far done to Neil

Click to expand...

Good... that means I should return to Strans Gill...  .  The natural aging process is a bitch.  It sneaks up on you and surprise you at the worst possible moment. 

CN.