Hi all.

Just about to buy 200m of new rope off the drum and was going to get it cut into various lengths.
We do a lot round the peak district and are managing a couple of raids to deepest darkest Yorkshire every so often.
I was thinking to split it at:
1x70m
2x40m
1x30m
1x20m

I also have 2x50m I inherited.

A good selection? Or any other suggestions on how to split it to enable us to access the best SRT trips with minimum cost.
Any help much appreciated.
mr conners

http://ukcaving.com/board/index.php?topic=5975.msg82156#msg82156
http://ukcaving.com/board/index.php?topic=6972.msg93948#msg93948
http://ukcaving.com/board/index.php?topic=4842.msg69360#msg69360

Cheers Chris, thanks for the prompt reply.

Off to sort it this weekend.

:bow:

Too late if you cut it up last week-end ? but for what it's worth, ages ago I analysed the rope lengths in the Elliot/Lawson rigging guide, with the following result:

Rope length 5 10 15 20 25 30 35 40 45 50 55 60 80 90
Frequency        1 7 21 19 17 19 13 6 4 5 3 12 1 1

Fulk said:

Too late if you cut it up last week-end ? but for what it's worth, ages ago I analysed the rope lengths in the Elliot/Lawson rigging guide, with the following result:

Rope length 5 10 15 20 25 30 35 40 45 50 55 60 80 90
Frequency        1 7 21 19 17 19 13 6 4 5 3 12 1 1

Click to expand...

.... according to which a 20m rope will suffice for 48 pitches...
.... a 40m rope will cover 55 pitches in the 20-40m range, ....
.... a 60m rope will suffice for another 29 pitches in the 45m-60m range and a 90m rope will do the rest.

Therefore to be able to do every single pitch (unless there are duplicates) you'll be looking at:

20m
40m
60m and
90m

Neat.

:-[Too late now Andy.........Its cut into 20/30/40/40/75.....got an extra 5 m on the reel!!!
Go nicely with the two 50m.
To be used on Friday!!
Guppy

Cheers Guppy.
Nettle on Friday night it is.
Then  in the Wanted.

Sorry if I'm stating the obvious ? but it sounds as though you haven't allowed for shrinkage . . . in a few weeks' time your 20/30/40/40/75 m ropes will be more like ~18, 27/8, 36/7, 36/7, 70-odd.

Use a sling at the initial belay clip in plus a butterfly knot instead of a bowline on the bight and you'll almost certainly have no worries with the rope lengths.

Ignore Ian. ALWAYS tie a stopper knot in the end.

Can't see how tieing a knot direct into a p-anchor is going to save any rope length whatsoever. Also if weight is an issue get Beal 8mm or 8.5mm Unicore.

One final thing: if you're cutting it a bit fine on rope length on a long pitch, make absolutely sure that you clip something to the end of the rope so that when you take your weight off the rope, the end doesn't spring back up out of reach.

cap 'n chris said:

Can't see how tieing a knot direct into a p-anchor is going to save any rope length whatsoever.

Click to expand...

[quote author=ianball11]I would save by threading through the p bolts and not tying knots[/quote]

Well it is April 1st....

cap 'n chris said:

Can't see how tieing a knot direct into a p-anchor is going to save any rope length whatsoever.

Click to expand...

ianball11 said:

I was considering calculating how much rope I would save by threading through the p bolts and not tying knots.

Click to expand...

Hook, line, sinker and this weeks copy of Angling Times.   

Who's spotted Google's April's Fool yet?

I think a good rope length is long enough to reach the bottom... </obvious answer>

:tease:

Amy said:

I think a good rope length is long enough to reach the bottom...

Click to expand...

You may say that, but I had a complaint from someone using one of my rigging guides that the rope length I recommended only just  reached the bottom of the pitch! I was very tempted to ask where they wanted it to go, but restrained myself.

langcliffe said:

Amy said:

I think a good rope length is long enough to reach the bottom...

Click to expand...

You may say that, but I had a complaint from someone using one of my rigging guides that the rope length I recommended only just  reached the bottom of the pitch! I was very tempted to ask where they wanted it to go, but restrained myself.

Click to expand...

  :-\ I have no clue there! Seems if it reaches the bottom that's all you need...or even just hovering a few inches from the bottom is enough, after all you can put your legs down and stand up giving you a few feet of leeway Soemtimes don't even need that!! Off some cliffs last summer I was watching some grotto members (this was before I had any vertical training hence why I wasn't doing it) by DeSoto Falls and they had 2 ropes rigged above the falls down to the water below (water was decently deep where they rigged over) it was a really hot day and one rope was too short by about 5 feet. So they'd just basically let go with their brake hand and zip off to splash into the nice cool water, swim over to the one that did reach, and climb back up that one 
Here's the falls those dudes were boldering, the ropes were rigged on the other side I don't have a photo of it.
Damn it was hot that day, like 45c with the heat index. The water was warm but still felt amazing!
DesotoFalls_0403 by Sunguramy, on Flickr

Sorry for not noticing the quaint 1st April reference but I'm out of the country and they don't do stupidoofussness here.

Still happy to reiterate the non-date-specific generic wisdom to *always* have a stopper knot in your rope before using it, though. Presuming you actually use a rope for abseiling, that is. (Poisson d'Avril).

Quote from Langcliffe:

You may say that, but I had a complaint from someone using one of my rigging guides that the rope length I recommended only just  reached the bottom of the pitch!

Click to expand...

Funny thing, but I have the opposite issue with the rigging guides, in that a number of rope lengths seem to be way too long. Sure, there are different styles of rigging ? tight vs. long loops, alpine butterflies vs. bunny?s ears knot, missing out extraneous bolts, starting a traverse a bit later than the first bolt . . . nevertheless, some of the discrepancies are quite major.
I first noticed this when I went for the first time to the final pitches of Gavel Pot; never having been there before, I checked with NC, which gives pitch lengths of 26 and 17 m. The CNCC rigging guide says that you need 55 and 40 m, respectively.
Well, even allowing for different styles of rigging, it seems odd that you need 55 m of rope for a 26 m pitch (it sounds even worse in feet ? 180 vs. 85!).
Well we took a 50 and a 26. The former was way too long, estimated from coiling by arms lengths at 17 m or so; on a subsequent occasion we found that a 40 m was more than adequate. The latter (the 26 m) was about right.

Here are a few others:

              CNCC Guide Our estimate
Hardrawkin Pot
                                    40 33
                        37 20
Juniper Gulf, big pitch
              30 + 60 13 + 57
Lancaster Hole
                    55 45 / too long
Pillar Holes / No. 2
          20 + 30 + 50 65
Swinsto Hole (split pitch)
                    60 ~42
Sunset Hole
                    34 25