Caroline Lucas's Bill to extend CROW access - my attempt to lobby her

[David Rose]

Some forum readers may know that following a change of job, I recently acquired a House of Commons lobby pass, which gives me full access to Westminster. Last week, amid the political mayhem, I managed to grab some time with Green MP Caroline Lucas, who is introducing a Privatre Member's Bill to extend CROW access rights to coastal areas and elsewhere. Currently it doesn't mention caving. I'd already emailed her and her staff about the BCA campaign and judicial review before we spoke.

She’d read my emails and said she was very sympathetic to our cause and would try to mention caving when her Bill is debated. However, she can’t amend it now because it’s already been presented without a clause on cave access.

Should it pass its second reading, she said, she would be open to amending it then, as parliamentary procedure rules would then make this possible. However, she said that she rates the prospects of this at less than 10%.

That said, we will be having an election before very long, at the latest by January 2025. If Labour wins, which seems likely, she would re-introduce the Bill afterwards (assuming she keeps her own seat, of course). At that point she would be very much prepared to redraft it, and with Labour in power it might well become law.

So the lines of communication are open. We’ll see what happens next.

I said after the end of the judicial review that I'd try to lobby politicians as a next step. This was a useful first step.

David Rose
Convenor, BCA CROW access working group

 

[Steve Clark]

Has she ever been caving? I would strongly suggest someone competent and enthusiastic invites her along to see what it's all about.

 

[Franklin]

Well done, Dave, good bit of work there. I agree with Steve - invite her up north to the Dales next time you're visiting.

 

[Pegasus]

I do hope she keeps her seat. Great effort, Dave. Yes let's take her caving

 

[JasonC]

I do hope she keeps her seat. ...

Keep her seat? She should be PM !!

 

[Goydenman]

Well done David, thanks

 

[badger]

There is always the east surrey mines stuff, not quite up to caves but at least underground. and close to Brighton where I believe she lives

 

[Ian Adams]

Great Stuff David, nicely done

 

[emetrolum]

Well done, Dave!

 

[Flotsam]

Time to buy a Dior suit and aftershave

 

[AlanClark]

Well done.

For those wanting to see the bill text and keep an eye on its glacial progress, 2nd reading is scheduled for 24th March 2023, see https://bills.parliament.uk/bills/3221

 

[RestingCaver]

Thanks for picking this up David. If I can be of any further help...
The Draft Bill attached.

 

[RestingCaver]

I wrote to Caroline Lucas in early October and she was quietly supportive. I suggested the amendment (see below) and she confirmed to me that "should the Bill progress beyond second reading, then I would be very happy to look at the issue again."

Thats encouraging since that's when the Bill could be amended. The second reading is on 24 March.

If a few Cavers were to write to their MP's to raise the profile of Caroline's Bill and to highlight the caving issue that could help.

Here's my suggested wording. Simple and to the point.

"3. Right to camp on Access Land and the right to enter in to caves in Access Land.
(1) Any person may camp on or cave in Access Land, provided that they comply with codes of conduct"

Cheers
Tim

 

[Badlad]

I went to see my MP, Julian Smith, about this bill back in December. He was very negative about it's chances of progression saying that the government had decided not to support it and therefore it had no chance.

Best chance is a new government I reckon

 

[mikem]

AlanClark link above also charts it's progress.

NFU viewpoint:

Access to land – NFU voices concerns to parliament

Countryside and Rights of Way Act has reached its Second Reading. Farmers are crucial in managing our iconic landscapes, now and for future generations. The NFU understands our vital role in providing access to the countryside and know the significant benefits to the wellbeing of society as a whole.

www.nfuonline.com

& British Canoeing:

All News

www.britishcanoeing.org.uk

 

[al]

Having recently moved to Scotland, I'm very impressed with their Land Reform Act, which gives general access to almost all open land here, including caves, and I did wonder, considering the shenanigans from the UK government regarding GRR and threatened over the bottles business, how on earth they had managed to get away with it. And then I realised that it became law in 2003, when Westminster was under Labour control.

Perhaps something for us cavers to remember in the 2004 election?

 

[al]

2024, obvs (fat fingers)

 

[Fjell]

Having recently moved to Scotland, I'm very impressed with their Land Reform Act, which gives general access to almost all open land here, including caves, and I did wonder, considering the shenanigans from the UK government regarding GRR and threatened over the bottles business, how on earth they had managed to get away with it. And then I realised that it became law in 2003, when Westminster was under Labour control.

Perhaps something for us cavers to remember in the 2004 election?

Because England isn’t Scotland. Especially southern England is heavily populated. Luckily we have a dense network of public footpaths which mean you can go pretty much anywhere (this largely didn’t exist in Scotland). To allow untrammelled access to all land will lead to serious conflicts and environmental damage. There is a case for the government to buy land to increase recreational space (riversides, coastlines). Forcing it on people is unlikely to go well.

The type of access we already do have does not exist in countries like the Netherlands with equally dense usage. You can walk on the beach. It does exist in Norway (another country I have lived in), because Norway is like Scotland. But in Norway they have a fetish of making it extremely difficult to access most hills by having few (often almost un-useable) paths and impenetrable forest. And they have trolls. Be careful what you wish for.

 

[MarkS]

To allow untrammelled access to all land will lead to serious conflicts and environmental damage.

Undoubtedly, but that isn't what the bill amendment is suggesting?

 

[Fjell]

In fact I was walking on the beach near Noordwijk on Sunday because we have been to see the Vermeer exhibition at the Rijksmuseum. And the topic of the utter lack of anywhere to walk came up.

Undoubtedly, but that isn't what the bill amendment is suggesting?

The bill has no chance because it is not based on any reality. I would start with “greenbelt”. What is that? It’s a planning definition not a geographical one. There is literally no difference between countryside inside or outside. In fact much of the best recreational land is outside it. It makes not the slightest sense. Many have argued that in fact we should be building on the greenbelt in preference to outside it, particularly around London where much of it is very nondescript.