Mendip Cave Rescue Response to Covid-19

[mikem]

I know, just pointing out that TOR posted it in first place!

It obviously refers to old guidance & only says "recommends", so don't think you need to worry about it (although I have mentioned it to the author):
https://british-caving.org.uk/wiki3/doku.php?id=conservation_access:cave_conservation_code
(Note, it is called just the caving code on website)

NCA was formed in 1968, so only local guidance was available before that, but pretty sure their original code also specified numbers, but can't find a copy.

EDIT - CSCC handbook for 1995 is even more direct : "No less than four in the party".

 

[crickleymal]

It doesn't matter what the minimum number is. The problem is distancing given that caving is usually a group activity.

 

[mikem]

It does in a general sense, rather than strictly covid19 related, as it could invalidate BCA insurance for smaller groups.

 

[PeteHall]

It doesn't matter what the minimum number is. The problem is distancing given that caving is usually a group activity.

For some, yes caving is usually a group activity. For others caving is usually solitary.

The two issues here are:
(1) whether a statement from a regional rescue organisation recommending minimum of four to a group will invalidate insurance for smaller groups in the case of an accident (now or future)
(2) given the government guidance that you can meet one other person, caving with more than two would be against government rules.

The two points taken together mean no caving, other than in a family/household group of four or more. So for pretty much everyone, no caving at all.

If the first statement is ignored as decades out of date, then one could feasibly go caving as a household group of less than 4 (much more likely), or alone (for those who are happy to do so), or as a group of 2 from different households as long as social distancing can be maintained (possible for a great number of caves I'm sure).

 

[mikem]

Social distancing is generally easy, not putting your hands in the same place as everyone else (other groups before you too) is more of a challenge - especially as cold, damp conditions are usually conducive to virus survival outside the body...

 

[Bob Mehew]

The NCA's Minimal Impact Caving Code states "Keep your party to a small size - a minimum of 4 and maximum of 6. Specific requirements may apply in certain instances."  I vaguely recall an argument in NCA Council over this statement between C&A and Training Committees over maximum numbers.  However, the NCA Cave Conservation Handbook makes reference to party sizes of two for cave conservation reasons in some cases.  (Amusingly the example cited is located on Mendip.) 

The NCA's MICC was replaced by the BCA MICC which states "The party size should be appropriate to the vulnerability of the cave."

Please also note BCA's statement at https://british-caving.org.uk/wiki3/doku.php which does not specify party size, just it's take on the legal requirement. 

 

[The Old Ruminator]

I was really trying to detach the minimum of four advice from anything to do with Covid-19.

 

[PeteHall]

One point nobody seems to have questioned is the comment that most caves are closed.

I can't find a list. Does anyone know if there is one?

 

[mikem]

Only from random posts covering swildons, Eastwater, st Cuthbert's, reservoir & fairy quarry caves (although I know climbers have been on the cliffs during lockdown). But majority are on farmland owned by those at high risk, so visits unlikely to endear you.

 

[The Old Ruminator]

I think that the FCQ management committee has been in touch with the climbers. Its not necessarily a good thing that nobody visits FCQ as a huge amount of fly-tipping has taken place at the old CSS cottage.

 

[andrewmcleod]

One point nobody seems to have questioned is the comment that most caves are closed.

I can't find a list. Does anyone know if there is one?

This is where the equivalent of the BMC's RAD (Regional Access Database) would be really useful...

 

[Jenny P]

One point nobody seems to have questioned is the comment that most caves are closed.

I can't find a list. Does anyone know if there is one?

A list is in the process of being compiled as part of the Derbyshire Cave Registry website - each entry now also includes its current access situation with regards to cv-19.  DCA is also at the moment posting on UKcaving notes about which caves are closed at the request of their owners.