Kenilworth
New member
pwhole said:
Not a safety or performance problem.
Rate my Rack!
- Thread starter JasonC
- Start date
Not a safety or performance problem.
alastairgott
Well-known member
pwhole said:
Haven't had any problem? Didn't we find out that locktite is essential with a banana on the allen key side otherwise it starts to undo itself mid trip!?!
pwhole said:
Stainless rack bars were discussed at some length over at aditnow.
https://www.aditnow.co.uk/community/viewtopic.aspx?t=10325&pid=1
pwhole
Well-known member
alastairgott said:
I meant I hadn't had a friction problem with stainless instead of ally. My disintegrating Banana was technically a different issue - as in, it wasn't tightened up enough! And halfway down Maskhill probably wasn't the best place to discover that fact, but there you go - I'm still here.
I voted still good but if aluminum I'd say middle option (I'm use to SS racks).
We tend to have hollow bars and rule of thumb if it ain't worn through to the hollow bit it's still perfectly saftey.
You could've just asked me to bring one over we do make proper racks in the US with fully replaceable bars.
...must say I was expecting pictures of boobs, though. Disappointed in the title of the thread. :tease:
We tend to have hollow bars and rule of thumb if it ain't worn through to the hollow bit it's still perfectly saftey.
You could've just asked me to bring one over we do make proper racks in the US with fully replaceable bars.
...must say I was expecting pictures of boobs, though. Disappointed in the title of the thread. :tease:
RobinGriffiths
Well-known member
Amy said:
I suspect OP was reeling us in on exactly the same bait.
pwhole
Well-known member
There's still time - especially if they're stainless boobs. Not keen on aluminium for the reasons mentioned above...
On a point of interest though, re: rope-coating from 'soft' bobbins/rack bars - has there been any testing done on whether the tiny metal particles are removed properly during washing? It's not micro-abrasion as such that I'm concerned about, but it somehow just doesn't seem like a good idea to me. I'd always used a Stop with a stainless bottom bobbin, so I was amazed just how quickly my bobbin was wearing out when I switched to a Banana - every rope I went down was grey immediately, and I wore a huge flat in about ten trips. The stainless is showing no wear at all from about the same, and it's no faster, so I'm inclined to stick with it.
On a point of interest though, re: rope-coating from 'soft' bobbins/rack bars - has there been any testing done on whether the tiny metal particles are removed properly during washing? It's not micro-abrasion as such that I'm concerned about, but it somehow just doesn't seem like a good idea to me. I'd always used a Stop with a stainless bottom bobbin, so I was amazed just how quickly my bobbin was wearing out when I switched to a Banana - every rope I went down was grey immediately, and I wore a huge flat in about ten trips. The stainless is showing no wear at all from about the same, and it's no faster, so I'm inclined to stick with it.
Kenilworth
New member
pwhole said:
I must wonder, if you aren't worried about micro-abrasion (polishing seems more likely) what are you worried about? I use Al brake bars, fig. 8, ATC, all of which have a long history of use and no documented history (that I have read) of problematic Al deposition.
While I very rarely wash my rope, I have done some informal testing. One fear has been that Al particles could penetrate the sheath, and abrade the core, dangerously weakening the rope (a fairly nonsensical fear, in my opinion), and that the common habit of pressure-washing rope might accelerate this process by driving particles into the core. The obvious way to visually test this theory is to split the rope, which I have done, to find the core as snowy as new. Others have found the same. Considering the small amount of contact it takes for an Al brake bar or other device to color the rope, it would seem that particles of a quantity to do damage (I don't think that such a quantity exists) would surely be visible within the core.
PeteHall
Moderator
MarkS said:
I can second that. I bought a kong rack off Tony Seddon at Eurospeleo (as my home-made rack is no good on thick rope and my other rack was stashed at a project a long way underground in another caving region). I practically cut the thing in half over the course of the week. It was nice to use, but I am seriously unimpressed by how quick it has worm out. I guess you get what you pay for.
PeteHall said:
The bars on the Kong Rakong are really poor. I took 3mm out of my Rakong bars on a single forty foot pitch. Its a shame because, quality of bars aside , it is a well designed bit of kit and a pleasure to use. The longevity of the bars is a total deal breaker.
My current weapon of choice is a home brewed 5 bar micro rack with 316, schedule 40 bars - I haven't looked back.
Im always happy to ship over racks if people wish. Karst Sports sometimes has sales happy to have it shipped to me to send out (avoids import fees that way). My bms microrack is still going strong and that's after seven years of use and a lot of time spent on shitty gritty rope in Unterstein 
andychapm
New member
Micro racks are a lot better than petzl racks. They're stainless steel and so much less prone to wear. The locking off bar is nice to use with heavy loads in scary places.
Whilst I've been caving in Mexico, I find I prefer a rack for the initial long drops as they descend far better on massive American pit ropes and you do find aluminium wears a bit fast and I've gone through top bobbins in a single trip. After I've got past the long pitches, I tend to swap over to a petzl stop as I find them much quicker on shorter pitches.
If you're after a new rack, I'd probably say to take Amy up on her offer to send a micro rack across. You'll probably wear through about 5 aluminium racks before you wear out one of these BMS racks.
Disgusted from Cornwall.
New member
Microracks. Don't like them. Get a 5 or 6 bar J rack and add or remove bars. They are suited for that purpose. You cannot "change gear" on a U rack. You might as well use a bobbin.
Disgusted from Cornwall. said:
And I take it you have gained wide experience with five bar micro racks since you expressed a similar opinion on Aditnow when this subject was discussed a year or so ago.
To summarise what I wrote on AN: One of the major advantages of a five bar micro is that you can change gear; you can run the rack on either four bars or you can dial in extra friction (in effect change gear) by running the rope over the hyperbar. You can also vary friction by moving the bars.
As someone has has used both traditional five bar rack (both Caving Supplies and Petzl) and five bar micro's (Kong Rakong, BMS micro, home brewed) I find that (a) The shorter length of the micro makes changeovers easier and (b) the hyperbar makes lock offs easier and to my mind more secure.
