Repairing oversuit?

[alanw]

Has anyone tried ShoeGoo as an alternative to Aquasure? I've got a tube, and after my kneepads suffered badly on the crawl in Voldemort recently, I repaired them with Kevlar thread and then coated the seams with ShoeGoo. My next trips are Lost Johns' and Sunset, so not much crawling to test them for a while.

 

[pwhole]

I've been using Gorilla contact adhesive for some time now and have found it very good for caving as it's tough and flexible, once applied. It's also easily available at many shops, unlike Aquasure. I'm lucky enough to live near a fishing tackle store who do sell Aquasure, but to be honest I thought this stuff was better. The arse of my AV is also disintegrating, but I have other suits in varying degrees of distress I can use if I know it's going to be a trashy trip but I won't get soaked on it.

https://uk.gorillaglue.com/gorilla-contact-adhesive-tube/

To be honest I've been eyeing up the Landjoff Cordura Extreme for some time now, due to its seemingly robust construction, and is recommended for digging. But as I do a lot of SRT as well, I'm worried it could be too thick and/or stiff to be practical for that as well - I can't find any mention of this model being used in the UK, and it's a lot of money to gamble, with postage.

https://landjoff.com/product/85/caving-coverall-cordura-extreme.html

 

[andrewmcleod]

I have realised that (after reading previous messages in the thread) my brain substituted Aquasure for Seamgrip. I use Seamgrip, not Aquasure. It is basically the same stuff (same manufacturer, same chemicals etc) but Seamgrip is runnier which makes it better at soaking into fabric but less good at gap-filling (it's also better at running off where you have applied it in drips over the 24 hours it takes to set).

 

[andrewmcleod]

I have also found that a reasonable non-cotton thread (I use Gutermann 'extra strong thread') is sufficient for most repairs. I use what some googling suggests is something like a blanket stitch to secure the patches on at the edge.

 

[Ed]

Dental floss works well for stitching. Being that much thicker it cuts the fabric less.

It's an old trick for repairing /mending wetsuits

 

[Pitlamp]

Has anyone tried ShoeGoo as an alternative to Aquasure? I've got a tube, and after my kneepads suffered badly on the crawl in Voldemort recently, I repaired them with Kevlar thread and then coated the seams with ShoeGoo. My next trips are Lost Johns' and Sunset, so not much crawling to test them for a while.

Yes - and I've found it slightly inferior. But it certainly can be used.

 

[Pitlamp]

It's great for mending worn edges of running shoes, which is how I originally came across it.

 

[thehungrytroglobite]

Thank you so so much for all your help everyone! There is some excellent advice in here. I'd never considered the possibility of using aquasure to strengthen seams *before* they break, or using smaller patches for repairs

 

[cavemanmike]

Copydex glue for me pre- glue the patches then re- apply some more and weigh them down. Always worked for me and my warmbac has looked like a patch work quilt for a few years now

 

[A_Northerner]

Just to add to the many voices saying it's not worth repairing. I've got a graveyard of AV oversuits, all of which I've attempted to repair and have lasted 1 or 2 trips before shredding again.

Last year I was torn (pun intended) between getting an oversuit right before Exped or just patching it up. I opted for repair and each day it tore open, and each day I spent up to an hour repairing it just to get me through the Exped. There's such a thing as a false economy of time as well!

Course then I was made redundant and I've had to manage an entire Freshers season on an oversuit that it barely held together at this point...

Just buy another one, it's part of the annual "caving tax" paid to Lil Tony S every year.

 

[andrewmcleod]

ah yes; while it is probably possible to repair any oversuit, at some point the effort probably exceeds the effort of sewing yourself a new one (which would also have the benefit of having a new oversuit rather than a tatty old one!), and the time that you _don't_ want to have a knackered old oversuit is when going on foreign trips/expeditions. If it totally fails, it's harder to do good fixes in the field and nothing would suck worse than missing out on trips because you don't have a suit/can't borrow one that day. It might even make it less safe (caving in a knackered oversuit) if you get hit by a flood pulse etc...

That said if you are actually going to 'Ardeche, Slovenia, Switzerland, France and possibly Austria too' then you might want to try and fix up the old suit _and_ buy a new one! (it's always good to have a spare)

 

[andrewmcleod]

And the last (and probably most important) piece of advice: a stitch in time saves nine. Try and fix your tears earlier rather than later and you can often make it last a lot longer. Remember that if you have a tear, it's likely that all the surrounding fabric is also knackered, so use a bigger patch than you think you need. Patching is, in my experience, always better than trying to sew up a tear which just leads to a parallel tear due to the extra stress on already worn fabric.

Not that I'm always good at that, of course - my current oversuit has a few things in need of repair! (although I'll be getting a new one in time for summer expeditioning...)

 

[topcat]

It is more than dead: it is decayed !

If you are going to run kit down to this degree you need to adopt 'a stitch in time saves nine' philosophy......from the start!

 

[Pitlamp]

Here's a picture of a repair to a tackle bag I did a while back, using Aquasure as a cement. It's one of those stupidly designed ones with a diagonal seam across the surface which is normally dragged along the floor (opposite from the handle). It's not rocket science to realise just how vulnerable to wear this seam is. The same method can be used on oversuits if they can be held flat.

1. Clean all components with a solvent cleaner thoroughly.
2. spread newspaper on the carpet before going any further and place the tacklebag / oversuit FLAT on it.
3. Apply Aquasure inside the grey "flap" (in this case) but not so much that it oozes out.
4. Apply Aquasure to the patch (in this case cut from an old PVC oversuit) and to the outside of the tacklebag.
5. Place a card or newspaper over the repair.
6. Place a big heavy book on the card.
7. Place loads of diving weights on the book to compress the whole assembly firmly.
8. Leave 24 hours at least, then remove card, book and weights.
9. Apply a protective bead of Aquasure on the remaining exposed stitching either side of the yellow patch.
10. Apply a bead of Aquasure around the edges of the patch so it doesn't catch and get pulled up in use.

The repair below has lasted for about 5 or 6 trips since. I often repair my PVC oversuits using a similar technique, usually with reasonable success.

You can also see that small blobs of Aquasure have also been used to repair umpteen minor blemishes elsewhere in the past; a stitch in time and all that . . .

Hope this helps.

 

[Ian Ball]

Does temperature affect the final strength of aquasure or other cements? I wonder if you left your bag/suit overnight in the garage or in the house would be a better method.

 

[amw]

Most “glues” will have a range they work in and a time to set Aquasure® Toluene Free Datasheet: Here

Andrew

​

 

[ChrisB]

I don't think the temperature during curing affects the final strength, but since it's chemical reaction it will cure faster if it's warmer. Aquasure actually cures by contact with moisture in the air, so humidity might makes difference. I wouldn't suggest dampening the materials, however, as a thin layer of water between the fabric and the Aquasure would not help.

McNett, who make Aquasure, also sell a product called Cotol 240, which accelerates the cure of Aquasure and can also be used to clean surfaces before applying it.

 

[thehungrytroglobite]

Attempting repairs. The aquasure won't come out the tube. Anyone know why / how I'm supposed to get it out? Was told it was supposed to be runny but this stuff is the opposite of runny...

 

[ChrisB]

It should be like treacle. If you poke a hole in the foil seal and squeeze the tube it should come out. Then I use a cocktail stick to spread it. But it does set in the tube if you've opened it previously and not kept it in the freezer.

 

[Pitlamp]

Attempting repairs. The aquasure won't come out the tube. Anyone know why / how I'm supposed to get it out? Was told it was supposed to be runny but this stuff is the opposite of runny...

If the tube is new (i.e. sealed) the contents should come out as soon as the seal is broken. As ChrisB has said, it's pretty viscous. Can you palpate the tube or does the whole thing feel solid? If the latter, it's "gone off" and is knackered. Only option is to buy a fresh tube (they have it at Inglesport).

If the tube was not newly opened, it may just be that the bit of Aquasure near the nozzle has set. If you poke a small screwdriver (or equivalent) through it, the contents should then start to emerge.

I use a lot of this stuff; when I start on a fresh tube I only break the seal with a needle, to minimise evaporation of the solvent in the compound. If it gums up over the following days I break more of the seal to free up the nozzle. Eventually the whole of the thin aluminium seal will be removed.

I agree with ChrisB (and others) that storing the tube in the freezer is the best way to keep it running freely. (This does require an element of anticipation before actually using it though.) In my case, I'm fairly active and always having to mend gear. So I usually just keep the opened tube in the fridge. If it's being used regularly it usually stays free-running.

But . . . I still think a replacement (cheap, 2nd hand) suit would be your best option!

If you do manage to effect repairs, it'd be good if you can post a photo or two.