Who's the Helmet without the helmet???

[legendrider]

Urbex/stoner crossover plumbs new depths of muppetry 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XIeeU4oZVMI

maybe I'm being too harsh - why waste hard-scrounged benefits on protecting what isn't there?


MARK

 

[Paul Marvin]

You would be surprised Mark just how many people go underground not dressed properly in fact how many people do you see riding a bike without one  . A & E is full of sensible people  :chair:

 

[tomferry]

I have asked my mates and no one seems to no this helmet so I am afraid I 

 

[Graigwen]

You would be surprised Mark just how many people go underground not dressed properly in fact how many people do you see riding a bike without one  . A & E is full of sensible people  :chair:

I think it is more common among mine explorers than cavers. Here is a picture of a mine explorer at the 1970 re-opening of Bwich Glas deep adit. She has taken off her helmet and lamp but is otherwise as kitted out when exploring the higher adit a few minutes earlier, including sandals. (It is almost unbelievable that she was guided by a prefessional.)

 

[tomferry]

I have heard of sandals used many times before due to their draining properties 

 

[Cantclimbtom]

I don't know where you guys are going with this, clearly the creator of the video has plans to monetize it.
YouTube rules state that all monetized videos feature people in baseball caps, they're only following the rules

 

[mikem]

...she was guided by a prefessional.)

Is that pre turning pro, or before con(fessional)?

 

[Graigwen]

I have heard of sandals used many times before due to their draining properties 

The notorious Mole, of the Welsh Mines Society, used to explore mines barefoot. Here he is in action at Nant y Mwyn a decade ago.

 

[Graigwen]

...she was guided by a prefessional.)

Is that pre turning pro, or before con(fessional)?

I think my job title had changed from Mine Surveyor to Geophysicist at that time.

.

 

[cavemanmike]

I think my job title had changed from Mine Surveyor to Geophysicist at that time.

.
Or do you mean mine engineer. Sorry wrong topic :blink:

 

[paul]

You would be surprised Mark just how many people go underground not dressed properly

A few years ago a group of us were surprised on a trip to Oxlow Cavern in the Peak. We arrived at the entrance to find three cavers about to descend the entrance shaft. They appeared to be a man and his late teenage / early  twenties sons.

They had brand new gear: everything from top to toe, oversuits, SRT gear, ropes, tackle bags, karabiners, the lot.

BUT between the three, not a single helmet!

They had some headlamps on their heads, but for some reason, no helmet.

A bit taken aback, I asked about the absence of helmets and the reply was that they had run out of money after buying everything else!

I suggested maybe they should have bought a bit less rope to start with (Oxlow Cavern requires a fair amount of rope) and get more later instead of skimping on helmets...

Anyway, they set off down the pitch and when we caught them up I heard "Ouch, I banged my head again!" from below us...

 

[Alex]

Came out of giants on Saturday I met 3 people exploring with nothing more than their phone lights, they had come across the entrance while walking I assume, as only my car was in the parking spot.

However, I understand the curiosity and if you don't know any better or simply can't afford proper equipment, then I can't fault them too hard. They are exploring and after all is not the drive for exploration what drives us all? I just warned them about the drop ahead and left them to explore, as it's a friendly cave otherwise (at least they had 3 phones between then).

 

[legendrider]

at least once on any given Thurdsay night, the soundtrack goes 'splosh splosh splosh CLONK Owwwww.. FECK! ' - and thats from 30-year seasoned minex veterans. 

Whilst I've no beef with stupid people hurting themselves, if its then splunked all over t'internet for others less cerebrally-endowed to emulate, or worse, creeps onto HSE's radar, then it becomes a serious issue.

Only a couple of months ago (I hardly need remind) COMRU attended a multi-agency incident in Teesdale where 3 inexperienced, but adequately-equipped explorers had got themselves well and truly stuck.  Happens, thankfully infrequently, but why load the dice and invite serious concussion, scalp laceration, skull fracture to the party?

The only positive here is that these gonks never seem to make it past the entrance lobby, which makes me wonder what, exactly is the point of it all anyway?

MARK

 

[PeteHall]

You would be surprised Mark just how many people go underground not dressed properly

A few years ago a group of us were surprised on a trip to Oxlow Cavern in the Peak. We arrived at the entrance to find three cavers about to descend the entrance shaft. They appeared to be a man and his late teenage / early  twenties sons.

They had brand new gear: everything from top to toe, oversuits, SRT gear, ropes, tackle bags, karabiners, the lot.

BUT between the three, not a single helmet!

Reminds me of a trip in Ease Gill several years ago. A couple of us were on our way down from Top Sink and caught up with a group around the area of Snail Cavern (if I've got the right name?), shortly before reaching the Minarets.

The group of three were all wearing matching brand new oversuits, helmets and lights, with a brand new harnesses and brand new tackle bag (presumably containing the rest of their brand new SRT kit).

We paused and asked them where they were going and the group leader said they were doing County to Wretched Rabbit, "this is the right way isn't it?" 

We offered to take them to Lancaster Hole, as it would not be too much of a detour from our route and it was rigged. I then checked that they had SRT kits and knew how to use them. The leader assured me they would be fine. I described the rebelay and asked if they were ok with that and the leader again assured me they would be fine.

As we were about to set off, one of the group spoke up and said he wasn't too confident about the rebelay and what other options did they have.

It transpired that the "leader" had been lead on a Wretched Rabbit to County trip the week before and had brought his mates along to reverse the trip. Their total SRT experience involved going down the County pitch earlier in the day. The leader hadn't noticed (or at least admitted) that on his previous trip, he'd been travelling in small passages, but was now in a stonking great cavern!

I too them back to Main Line Terminus, where we fortunately bumped into a group who were heading out Wretched Rabbit and kindly agreed to escort the three numpties out. I say three numpties, it was really one numpty and his mates, who, had they not spoken up about not being very confident at SRT, might have ended up in an even worse situation.

Having bought all the kit, I sincerely hope that the two mates found someone more reliable to take them caving in future and I hope that the "leader" realised how lucky he was to have met two groups who were prepared to help them out, otherwise they would have had a long wait for rescue!

The phrase "all the gear, no idea" springs to mind.

 

[PeteHall]

Came out of giants on Saturday I met 3 people exploring with nothing more than their phone lights, they had come across the entrance while walking I assume, as only my car was in the parking spot.

However, I understand the curiosity and if you don't know any better or simply can't afford proper equipment, then I can't fault them too hard. They are exploring and after all is not the drive for exploration what drives us all? I just warned them about the drop ahead and left them to explore, as it's a friendly cave otherwise (at least they had 3 phones between then).

Exactly the right thing to do in my opinion. I regularly give people a few tips for 'safely' exploring Goatchurch with just their phones. I describe the through route, advise them to go in the main entrance and out tradesman's and advise them to avoid the side passages, some of which can lead to a drop. I also advise them that if they want to see more, they can book with an instructor and if they like it there are loads of caving clubs in the area. Invariably, if you see them afterwards, they've either turned around at the end of the entrance passage, or successfully made the trough trip; either way, they are really happy and keen to book up with an instructor to see some more. 

 

[paul]

Yes - it reminds me of an old DCRO call-out:

284: JUG HOLES, MATLOCK
Thursday 20th July 2000
Three Youths from Bonsall were reported overdue on a trip into Jug Holes. They were reported to have entered the Lower Adit with the intention of coming out of the large entrance further up the hill. Two local team members were first on site and they went down the upper entrance quickly finding the missing party about a hundred metres into the system. The youths had become lost about an hour or so after entering the cave and their torches had failed one by one leaving them little choice but to stay put. They were cold but uninjured and they were helped out of the cave after the climb up to the upper entrance had been rigged to assist them. They were poorly equipped for the trip with inadequate lighting and clothing. Only one had a "helmet" - a rather fetching stainless steel kitchen colander with a broken string chin strap! They did not seem to have been put off caving but did agree to go better equipped next time.

I wonder if they eventually took up caving?

 

[Digit]

It has always struck me as fortunate that Darwin did not do his research on humans, if he had we would probably never have heard of him.
Some years ago, going up Snowdon with friends via the Cib 'path' we came across a very distressed middle aged lady in street clothing.  She was sat straddling the ridge, physically rigid, mentally frantic.  After a longish and difficult conversation it transpired that a) she wanted to go up Snowdon, b) was scared of hights, c) thought it would be ok as it was very misty, d) just used the 'path' she saw someone else using. Needless to say the mist lifted the instant after she got to the ridge.

 

[Fishes]

Yes - it reminds me of an old DCRO call-out:

284: JUG HOLES, MATLOCK
Thursday 20th July 2000
Three Youths from Bonsall were reported overdue on a trip into Jug Holes. They were reported to have entered the Lower Adit with the intention of coming out of the large entrance further up the hill. Two local team members were first on site and they went down the upper entrance quickly finding the missing party about a hundred metres into the system. The youths had become lost about an hour or so after entering the cave and their torches had failed one by one leaving them little choice but to stay put. They were cold but uninjured and they were helped out of the cave after the climb up to the upper entrance had been rigged to assist them. They were poorly equipped for the trip with inadequate lighting and clothing. Only one had a "helmet" - a rather fetching stainless steel kitchen colander with a broken string chin strap! They did not seem to have been put off caving but did agree to go better equipped next time.

I wonder if they eventually took up caving?

I was on the colander boy rescue. The main issue they seemed to have was that they had all bought the cheapest of torches from Wilko which all went out at the same time. At least they had the common sense to let someone know where they were going who could call out a rescue team.

I can't get overly exited about someone going a short distance into Rampgill without a helmet. There are lots of surface walks most of us would do without a helmet that are probably much more hazardous.

 

[legendrider]

We are all at liberty to embrace our own private and personal threshold as to what constitutes acceptable risk - some set that bar a little lower than others.

A line is crossed when patently risky behaviour is promulgated on an indiscriminate internet platform, which by merely existing, in some minds normalises and even encourages aberrant behaviour.

Believe me when I say that our pastime is under close scrutiny by unelected powers and the fewer noisy idiots we have on our periphery, the better, in my humble opinion.

MARK

 

[Graigwen]

...she was guided by a prefessional.)

Is that pre turning pro, or before con(fessional)?

I think my job title had changed from Mine Surveyor to Geophysicist at that time.

.

But I was certainly prefessional, as at that time my only qualification was a degree in International Politics.

.