Mad phone calls this week on CRoW, a winning photograph, Wordsworth gets in on the act and a new dream to connect the Three Counties System to the 'stunning' Calf Holes.  It's all in the Times you know.......

Any chance of a link please?

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/potholers-fight-for-right-to-dangle-6xtbmrmz5

Although the radio advert only mentions Clarkson & Hammond...

Mike

That's a headline for the ages! Might have to get a copy framed in the SUSS Library - it will be a good memoir for when all this access faff is history!

I didn't want to mention it on the thread about the photograph winner at Kendal as I thought it an unnecessary distraction...

But what a lovely irony that the picture won the  'Adventure in the Outdoors' at Kendal Mountain Festival.

Outdoors you say... 

Stuart Anderson said:

I didn't want to mention it on the thread about the photograph winner at Kendal as I thought it an unnecessary distraction...

But what a lovely irony that the picture won the  'Adventure in the Outdoors' at Kendal Mountain Festival.

Outdoors you say... 

Click to expand...

Not all caves have locked doors on them!

Stuart Anderson said:

I didn't want to mention it on the thread about the photograph winner at Kendal as I thought it an unnecessary distraction...

But what a lovely irony that the picture won the  'Adventure in the Outdoors' at Kendal Mountain Festival.

Outdoors you say... 

Click to expand...

Outdoors maybe. Sadly not "open air" 

Good article

Thank you for sharing it...

It's great to get more of this public exposure for such a important issue...

What a fantastic photograph to...

Three countries to Calf Holes connections ....they are there somewhere.....

Good article

Thank you for sharing it...

It's great to get more of this public exposure for such a important issue...

What a fantastic photograph to...

Three countries to Calf Holes connections ....they are there somewhere.....

Outdoors maybe. Sadly not "open air"

Click to expand...

Section 193 Law of Property Act 1925.  Public has a legal right to take "air and exercise" on Urban Common land such as Mynydd Llangattock which includes Agen Allwedd and Daren Cilau, and the Ogof Draenen catchment.  Note this access right is not restricted to open air.

NRW accepts that caving is air and exercise.  They'd have to after DEFRA lost the Billson Judicial Review in which it was argued by DEFRA that horse riding isn't air and exercise.

So NRW goes on to say that urban commons don't include the caves in the land.  This is despite Section 205 defining "land" as including mines and minerals, any strata or seam of minerals or substances in or under any land.  In other words, land is three dimensional not just the surface.

Make your own mind up.

There is hope, in Wales anyway.  It seems the Welsh Government's preferred and more inclusive term to replace "air and exercise" (LPA) and "open-air recreation" (CROW) and "exercise and recreation" (Forestry Act) is simply "non-motorised recreation".

I hope the WG will eventually amend the CROW Act to differentiate Wales from England by saying that the public access right in Wales will be for "non-motorised recreation" while leaving caving off the "banned list" at Schedule 2 which is the status quo.

Seems a good phrase that.

droid said:

Seems a good phrase that.

Click to expand...

I'm not so sure. They would want to allow motorised wheelchairs. They could just dump the word 'open-air' and leave it as simply 'recreation'.

Can the Welsh Government amend UK legislation? I'm not sure I like the idea of a differentiation between Wales and England. I'd prefer us all to work together to get DEFRA to cave in. Or is it to our collective benefit if the case is won in Wales?

Can someone PDF the page or copy the text so that those of us who aren't subscribers/don't want a mountain of spam e-mails can read the piece?

Thanks!

I'll try and do that when I get home, unless anyone else can help...

Or non Mechanical Propelled Vehicles.

Seems logical as Mechanically Propelled Vehicles already has a clear definition under CROW, being used in relation to unsealed highways and the changes from BOATs to Restricted Byeways

Keep in mind that there is Mark Burkey's winning shot of Calf holes across the top of this piece which the journalist wanted to link in to the Three Counties story somehow.  This article came from interviews with me and others lasting several hours.

Thank you for posting this.

Ali.

Who here among use wouldnt want to do a Calfholes to Cumbria through trip?

In 50 years there will be no talk of the "Three Counties System" as it will have been fully extended to the "Three Valleys System" 

Also it will be in 4 counties as the SUSS Dig in P8, Derbyshire will also inevitably follow the Pennine Way and strike straight into the heart of Easegill.