Author Topic: Chest Ascender - time for a new one  (Read 2529 times)

Offline Roperat

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Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« on: June 18, 2017, 10:08:40 am »
Hi All,

With the newer model Croll not getting rave reviews i thought i'd pose the question to see what others are using.
My current Croll is having a few issues and it's time for a change. (if anyone is interested, the issue is that the rope isn't feeding down through it anymore, losing efficiency)

What are people using and recommending instead of the Croll, or better still what have people replaced their Croll with, and what are the results?

Online Dave Tyson

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2017, 10:51:53 am »
Climbing Technology (CT) evo jammer.  about £42.

Very similar size to old petzl, does the job

Dave

Offline cavemanmike

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2017, 11:26:28 am »
Camp turbo everytime  :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Offline Oceanrower

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2017, 02:09:28 pm »
I've got a Camp Goblin.

No, I know it's not a chest ascender, it's an ascender cum back up device but, ... .

I just like saying I've got a Camp Goblin!

 :lol:

Offline Roperat

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2017, 12:25:49 am »
Camp turbo everytime  :thumbsup: :thumbsup:


Really? CAMP turbo? Those things look too clunky and over engineered to me? Is that not the case?

Offline NewStuff

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #5 on: June 19, 2017, 06:36:11 am »
I love my Turbochest. It's tiny, smaller than the new Croll. Clunky it is not. I find it easier to ascend with. How much of that is to do with the roller, and how much is the change in the angle the rope runs at, is anyone's guess.

I got rid of 2 almost new "old" crolls with years of life, once I had a go with it. I liked it that much.
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Offline cavemanmike

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #6 on: June 19, 2017, 08:09:17 am »
I've never used the new petzl crol but didn't like the reviews it was getting so opted for the camp turbo and never had a problem with it.
To be fair I did like my old petzl crol but I wore it out and couldn't find another one

Offline tamarmole

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2017, 08:12:48 am »
Another vote for the Camp turbo.  I particularly like the fact that it allows the rope to run freely at the bottom of a pitch.

Offline Roperat

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #8 on: June 19, 2017, 08:22:25 am »
How about their use in rescue situations? Are they able to get a biner in their chest loop point?

Online MarkS

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #9 on: June 19, 2017, 08:55:41 am »
+1 for the Turbo Chest. I've just replaced my first one after about 2.5 years of fairly heavy use.

Offline Mike Hopley

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #10 on: June 19, 2017, 11:54:30 am »
How about their use in rescue situations? Are they able to get a biner in their chest loop point?

Good question. Yes, you can clip into the top hole for rescue.

Offline pwhole

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #11 on: June 19, 2017, 12:08:53 pm »
I've only used my Turbo twice so far, but I do like it. I noticed the rope doesn't always sit on the rollers immediately, but I think that's as much me needing to adjust my technique for the device. But very smooth ascents, and the cam opens easily too, which is nice. I have bought another Croll for 'sacrificial' use, as a grotty job I was on recently totally trashed my CT ascender, but ironically didn't get to do another rope-trip there, so it never got used. But if I'm on filthy nasty trips I'll use that, and keep the Turbo for 'regular' use.

Offline Roperat

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #12 on: June 19, 2017, 09:06:13 pm »
Hmmmm maybe I'm sold on trying one out..... any negatives of them? How flimsy are the rollers and the attachment point of the rollers? Are they easily bent inwards, etc? I have a habit of wearing my harness through squeezes..... (I know what you'll say, take it off) but I tend to give my gear a bit of a hiding.

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Offline David Rose

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #13 on: June 20, 2017, 10:45:19 pm »
I like the CT ascender. It's very easy to open it at a rebelay, and the rope runs through smoothly. It never - and I mean never - slips. The CT footloop ascender is good, too. It inspires confidence.

Offline Roperat

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #14 on: June 20, 2017, 11:29:24 pm »
I like the CT ascender. It's very easy to open it at a rebelay, and the rope runs through smoothly. It never - and I mean never - slips. The CT footloop ascender is good, too. It inspires confidence.
Thanks david. I've been using one of them at work, but when on more horizontal than vertical rebelays I've had them pop off. Not that we should really end up on horizontal, but it can happen.

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Offline nihil_enochian

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #15 on: July 25, 2017, 12:36:58 am »
I like the CT ascender. It's very easy to open it at a rebelay, and the rope runs through smoothly. It never - and I mean never - slips. The CT footloop ascender is good, too. It inspires confidence.
Greetings my fellowship cavers. I am new on this forum so please be gently. :D
I wanted to ask everyone who use CT chest or hand ascender, is it made for cave rescuing. There is markings on the rear side of them say that they are for 100kg max load. And when I looked for Petzl croll there is no markings about max load but in the technical sheet is written that max load is 140kg. Is Petzl products so much better then the CT or what is point with that. Sorry for my English, it is not my native language, but I hope that you understand me.

Cheers from Serbia.

Offline Antwan

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #16 on: July 25, 2017, 09:21:15 am »
Hi Nihil,


How I understand it, everything designed for work use now has a trend to be rated to 140kg for when technitions are loaded with drills, buckets and other tools.

I would have a guess that the camp is either aimed at the recreational market or they just havent caught up with the trend yet.

Im sure Mark Wright will be able to tell you if I am right or not

Offline MJenkinson

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #17 on: July 25, 2017, 09:28:08 am »
I may be wrong on this, but I am sure that most of these things a) have enough factor of safety that a one-off rescue type event will be fine (being sensible of course!) and b) they probably have an exceptional use rating.

I am sure Petzl stops state 150kg max or something, but can be used "occasionally" up to 200Kg for rescue?

Obviously if you were working in a rescue team and all it got used for was rescue then I would get something more heavy duty, but for the occasional rigging of personal rescue rigging then I bet "it be reet".

Noting that I banned the drillers I used to work with saying "it be reet" as it never bloody was.

Offline Fulk

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #18 on: July 25, 2017, 09:32:09 am »
I'm not sure that nihil will understand '"it be reet" '   ;D

Offline Roperat

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #19 on: July 25, 2017, 09:33:52 am »
I'm not sure that nihil will understand '"it be reet" '   ;D
A caving motto of mine. "We're f'd anyway"

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Offline MJenkinson

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #20 on: July 25, 2017, 09:51:15 am »
I'm not sure that nihil will understand '"it be reet" '   ;D

Fingers crossed for google translate...

То ће бити у реду
To će biti u redu

Online Mark Wright

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #21 on: July 25, 2017, 11:07:04 am »
The markings on products such as ascenders and descenders can certainly be very confusing, particularly when it comes to maximum loads.

Crolls have 140kg actually marked on the back of the device and the Turbochest has 120kg marked on the back of it, or at least the ones on the Camp website do. If your Croll doesn't have such markings then it is probably quite an old one. My new Croll is marked with 140kg.

Rather than it being a 'trend' to mark products in such a way it is actually a legal requirement for manufacturers to mark the weight used during the testing to the various standards.

As far as EU standards are concerned the minimum test weight is 100kg, which is to represent a worker and their tools. For industrial purposes the US market require a test weight of 140kg which is why Petzl test their products with 140kg in order to be able to sell in this market.

If the Turbochest is only marked with 120kg then this suggests it wouldn't pass the various tests with 140kg otherwise they would have tested it with 140kg.

There are a number of tests products have to pass in order to gain the EN567 or EN12841B standards including FF1 drop tests and static load tests. Overloaded ascender devices don't usually break, they just damage the rope they are attached to. According to the above standards they should be able to hold a 450kg load before damage to the rope occurs. Petzl ascenders will generally hold 600kg before rope damage occurs.

When you ask about rescue use I assume you mean can two people be suspended from an ascender?

The answer to this is yes, but you have to be very careful to avoid any dynamic loading. This would be the same advice for any toothed ascender device.

Mark





Offline Ian Ball

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #22 on: July 25, 2017, 12:26:55 pm »
 :thumbsup:

Offline nihil_enochian

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #23 on: July 25, 2017, 12:55:35 pm »
I'm not sure that nihil will understand '"it be reet" '   ;D

Fingers crossed for google translate...

То ће бити у реду
To će biti u redu
Haha, yes google translated this very well.
Thank you everyone for great replies, especially Mark Wright.
I attached photos of my new CT croll and you can see what I mean. I just don't understand how this new little Petzl croll have 140kg max load, and my CT only 100kg. For the reason that I have read on this forum I didn't want to buy Petzl, so instead I bought this one. I also read some very good reviews on his forum about CT ascenders.

Quote
When you ask about rescue use I assume you mean can two people be suspended from an ascender?

Yes, I was meant on that.

I want to say that this is far most the best forum about caving that I visited. We don't have in Serbia something like this. But we have some great caves and pits. :D

Offline Ian Ball

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Re: Chest Ascender - time for a new one
« Reply #24 on: July 25, 2017, 03:17:42 pm »
That is very snazzy.