Hi
I've just had my appendix removed by keyhole surgery and I'm wondering how long it might take before I can get back into caving (got an expedition coming up in October).  Doctors recommendations obviously a bit vague and leave a wide margin for error.

Has anyone else had similiar surgery that can give an indication how long it took for them to recover and go caving again (don't worry I won't sue you if I turn out to be different).
I'm 40 years old and had been doing quite a lot of running and gym work before it happenned.
Just don't want to start swinging big rucksacs around in my usual style too soon and do myself a mischief again!
Any advice gratefully received
Mark

I had a robotic hysterectomy, four tiny incisions in my abdomen, start of March this year. Doc said 'most people are back to work within a week or two at most'. I felt pretty poor for about a week, and then was able to move around a little better generally.  It was supposed to be four weeks recovery time for normal activity. Four weeks post op check, cleared to resume normal activity. Mid-April (seven weeks post) attempted first cave trip, easy borehole cave, surveying so a slow trip. I got to the first breakdown pile and fell over. This is a cave I know well, breakdown I can skip over because i know where to put my feet and hop across. The easiest beginner breakdown ever. I had to literally hands and knees crawl/climb over the very simple breakdown, and required someone spotting me to ensure I didn't hurt myself (it was really rather embarrassing). I had zero balance, and I hadn't noticed this walking/hiking/etc. Fast forward until July (so 4-5 months post) and I was able to start actually caving again, but it took effort and I got tired easily because of the extra effort. Finally now starting to almost feel "normal" again.

I'd personally give it more like 6-8 weeks post any sort of surgery that cuts into your abdomen before you even attempt caving again, and expect it to be shit, and build up slowly so you don't fall and crack your head open like I almost did. Expect four to six months before resuming "normal caving", because "Normal Activity" means "go to work, go to a restaurant, enjoy the theatre, go for a walk or jog" not something crazy like caving. And yes, I had specifically asked about caving. Doctors don't know any this unless you have a caving doctor!

Of course YMMV

Well, you did ask, Mark! 

Hi Mark,

I was in a similar position - early 40s, running regularly and caving 1 or 2 times a week. I had keyhole surgery last December, and managed a fairly gentle caving trip (a slow potter around OFD1 round trip) about 6 weeks after surgery.

My surgery was to remove a small (benign) lump from my lung, and initially I recovered pretty quickly. I was told to go for a walk each day, and by the time I had my post op assessment (which was 2 weeks after the operation) the walks were up to 7 or 8 miles. I managed a short, slow run 3 weeks after the operation and probably pushed things a little too much with a couple more runs in the next two weeks.

My experience was that it took longer than I thought it would to fully recover from the general anaesthetic, and I was feeling more run down and tired than I would have expected for several weeks.

You might also struggle to get insurance for a caving expedition that soon after surgery . Snowcard want to talk to you to discuss medical issues (and offer more expensive insurance ) if you have had an overnight stay in hospital in the previous 12 months. I wasn't allowed to catch a flight for a few weeks either, although that was probably due to where I had my operation (they seem particularly anxious after operations on lungs). People are, in general, more at risk of DVT after an operation that involves a general anaesthetic.

As Amy says, when the doctor says that you are fit to return to normal activities, they mean that you can drive to work and perhaps go out to the cinema / go out for a meal. Caving isnt normally included in the list of "normal activities".

Everyone will recover from an operation at different speeds, and you may well be fine to go dragging a large rucksack around Mulu for days on end, but you may find that it might be just a bit too soon.  Is there a contingency plan that would perhaps involve spending more time around camp / helping input survey data for the first few days while you get your strength back?

Cheers,
complex

cavermark said:

I'm 40 years old and had been doing quite a lot of running and gym work before it happenned.

Any advice gratefully received
Mark

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Getting younger isn't really an option so I'd suggest you give up the running and gym work - 

I will start organising my sedan chair with distoX attachment 

Maybe you need one of these...

http://www.tracfab.com/

The trouble is, you need a category H driving licence to use it on the road (or pavement?) in the UK.

I had my gallbladder removed by keyhole surgery in 2012.  I was 39 at the time, and had made sure I was as fit as possible before the op.
I was rather surprised just how incapacitated I was for the first week after the op - you really do need those abs!  I was signed off work for 2 weeks, which was just enough, but a few extra days would have made me feel a bit more comfortable.  I was not able to do much at all the first week, in the second week I slowly built up very short walks (first attempt to walk around the cricket pitch I had to stop at 3 benches!).
I can't remember how soon after the op I started running again, but I built up very slowly from the short walks.
First caving trip was 5 1/2 weeks after the op (Swildon's round trip for the 50th Anniversary), again I took it very easy, and was prepared to go straight back out if it felt uncomfortable at any point, but it was fine.
Ran a half marathon 7 1/2 weeks after the op - slightly steeper build up than I would have liked mileage wise, but again I took it all easy and was fine.
Mountaineering exped to India 11 1/2 weeks after the op - this was fine, and I'd had plenty of time to recover and build up fitness again.
Good luck with the recovery.

From the way people are talking I suggest you spend some of your expedition time doing non-strenuous and useful things, like learning Therion. Happy to give one on one lessons.

I've had 3 abdominal operations, one of them keyhole, and while initial recovery has been surprisingly quick, wounds healing quickly, back walking on rough ground in two weeks, it takes a lot longer than seems reasonable to be back to full fitness. There's a lot of internal healing to do, and the body takes a long while to recover from the assault.

The keyhole surgery means the wounds heal more easily, but I don't think it affects the longer term healing so much - it's a bit of a head start as opposed to a miracle cure.

kay said:

I've had 3 abdominal operations, one of them keyhole, and while initial recovery has been surprisingly quick, wounds healing quickly, back walking on rough ground in two weeks, it takes a lot longer than seems reasonable to be back to full fitness. There's a lot of internal healing to do, and the body takes a long while to recover from the assault.

The keyhole surgery means the wounds heal more easily, but I don't think it affects the longer term healing so much - it's a bit of a head start as opposed to a miracle cure.

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Talking to the specialist nurse after my recent surgery I was told that tissue heals in six weeks but it takes a further six weeks for it to get back to normal.

Thanks for all the advice (and the pm from Dr Brendan S).