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Descent 310 is out now.
....so prepare to see some of the best writing and photography from the caving world
Including: Into the Echo Chamber, Tim Allen reports on another magnificent Yorkshire Dales find by the Space Miners....and: The Great Geoff Yeadon, undoubtedly one of the greats of the caving world. Following his death at the age of 75, Geoff Crossley, Martin Grass and Mick Nunwick pay tribute to him.
Quick Daren Cilau question
- Thread starter Alkapton
- Start date
Personally I never used cowstails anyway in Antler Passage. There are a number of ladders in place, but I doubt every drop has one.It's worth remembering though that there are still plenty of areas where falls could happen, and care is still needed. I'm not sure what you used cowstails for originally, so can't comment on whether you might feel you still need them. If it was for protection getting on and off the climbs, then I assume you'll still want them to protect yourself on and off the ladders.
It's probably also worth thinking about what you'd do if you fell onto your cowstails anyway (I assume you're not going to wear a harness, for example, and probably won't have any way of getting yourself back off the cowstails either if you end up suspended in space).
It's probably also worth thinking about what you'd do if you fell onto your cowstails anyway (I assume you're not going to wear a harness, for example, and probably won't have any way of getting yourself back off the cowstails either if you end up suspended in space).
Muddy Funkster
Active member
There are chain and steel rung ladders in place on all pitches along Antler now. Very stable, almost bomb proof in construction. I have done Antler twice now since this was done and no cows tails are required. Provided you are able to free climb a ladder without falling off 
There are even foot plates on some of the traverses, the trip has been made much easier thanks to the hard work of several Chelsea members. Even helped with the first of the 5 ladders myself.
Matt
There are even foot plates on some of the traverses, the trip has been made much easier thanks to the hard work of several Chelsea members. Even helped with the first of the 5 ladders myself.
Matt
Muddy Funkster
Active member
However I should add that if you have not done this trip before the Antler way in is far longer distance wise that the crawl. So if you wanted some variation in your trip (through trip) I would advise going in the crawl whilst you have a good supply of energy and out through now much more civillised Antler / Busmans route.
Matt
Matt
Muddy Funkster
Active member
I take it you've not been in Daren at all then? Well you're in for a treat, takes a while to get through Busmans and Antler but once beyond them there's a lot of really nice stuff to see. Don't stop at the Antlers though just beyond them are Urchin Oxbow and the White Company. All worth seeing.
Matt
Matt
Muddy Funkster
Active member
Quite right Nig! There have been quite a few callouts in Daren recently, mostly overdue parties. The biggest drop is the ladder pitch before the Antlers are met, about 5 - 6m a drop onto a jumble of boulders. Definately not a place to be climbing on your own.
Matt
Matt
Alkapton
Member
NigR: I am slowest in cave new to me simply because I cant risk even a small fall. I turn back Sat because I get to fault free climb near end of Busmans. I proove I can get up and down it ok by getting upper body through but had already decided I gone far enougth. Next time I get there quicker and get past. I believe solo caving is fine if one does not go past ones limits. Reason for this thread is to remove confusion caused by reading too much. Electron ladders need tails at least. nice fixed ladders fine.
My thanks to you Tony and all others who have made Cnwc such an exellent experience. Am still on a high from Sat
My thanks to you Tony and all others who have made Cnwc such an exellent experience. Am still on a high from Sat
Duncan Price
Active member
It might be worth emphasising that the permanent ladders along Antler Passage are flexible ladders made from steel chain with metal rungs bolted between them. They are "fixed" in the sense that they are intended to be left in situ for their lifetime but not rigid. Therefore they will swing around a bit like electron ladders when you climb them.
Alkapton said:
Electron ladders need a lifeline.
Alkapton said:
Not if you fall off them!
Alkapton said:
My own involvement in the improvements (?) that have taken place in Price's Dig (Cnwc) is limited solely to the enlargement of the dry bypass squeeze at the connection point with Busman's. This was done some time after it was initially passed at the request of Stuart France (CSS Secretary). My intention was to enable the further exploration of the cave (towards OCAF), not to help create a popular through trip or an easier route into Antler Passage. The credit for the underground via ferrata that now exists (along with the subsequent passage modification) belongs firmly with Stuart and his friends (mainly, but not entirely, CSS members) who assisted him.
Muddy Funkster
Active member
I bet you could get a stretcher around the right angled corner now though Nig
Alkapton
Member
The right angle in cwnc? That would be challanging with a stretcher. And its easier to find me than it is to wrap me in a stretcher, I'm not dead yet and seldom paralytic even if I try to get in such a state.
Electron ladder plus belay verses SRT... Only one winner there. I see pictures of twenty plus meter free hanging pitches with electron ladders and just think why? Much simpler without ladder and quicker.
Electron ladder plus belay verses SRT... Only one winner there. I see pictures of twenty plus meter free hanging pitches with electron ladders and just think why? Much simpler without ladder and quicker.
