Saltpeter

[Les W]

Interesting article from 1912:
https://pubs.usgs.gov/bul/0523/report.pdf

Nice find, cheers. 

 

[Kenilworth]

What's "moonmilk" then ?



Ian

A mystery so far. I found some unusual formations in a small Ohio cave, and asked for input from Carol Hill and Paolo Forte, who disagreed on their potential origins. Hill believed them to have a biological component, originating as moonmilk, Forte said, not necessarily, such formations had been found among "traditional" evaporates. I later found a moonmilk deposit that showed similarities to the solidified mystery formations, so I think I agree with Hill. But there is a lot of confusion and disagreement about moonmilk in general, which I think is splendid.

Some fuzzy documentary footage of the above described:
https://youtu.be/ZVkzXhRbdw0

https://youtu.be/7AOMT2hQue8

 

[Ian Adams]

1) Grab a small sample.

2) put it into a small, clear, plastic bag (say, 2 inches square).

3) Go to any airport.

4) Customs will find it, swab it and analyse it on their machine.

5) When it comes back negative for narcotics, ask the custom's officer what the machine said it was.

Simple?



Ian

 

[droid]

Genius 

 

[grahams]

Genius 

There is a slight flaw in the method in that, if the moonmilk has resulted from bacterial action, something in the resulting chemical mix might show up as dodgy.

 

[Ian Adams]

..... something in the resulting chemical mix might show up as dodgy.

Put it in your mates bag?



Ian

 

[cavemanmike]

..... something in the resulting chemical mix might show up as dodgy.

Put it in your mates bag?



Ian

there's already to much of that going on in our club

 

[Fulk]

Les W:

Calcium nitrate is also the Saltpetre that was extracted in the US caves.
Calcium nitrate is very soluble so is only to be found in dry caves.
The calcium nitrate was leached from the cave soil in vats, collected and then taken from the caves to be processed.
The first stage was to concentrate the solution using evaporation, generally using wood fires.
The concentrate was then reacted with potash (potassium carbonate, from the ashes of the wood fires used in the evaporation process). The calcium would be precipitated as calcium carbonate and would be replaced by the potassium in the solution to make potassium nitrate. The subsequent solution would be further "dried" by evaporation and the saltpetre crystals would remain.
The process is well documented and was primarily used to produce saltpetre for gunpowder, when the main source was denied.

I wonder who first thought that up?

 

[Les W]

Les W:

Calcium nitrate is also the Saltpetre that was extracted in the US caves.
Calcium nitrate is very soluble so is only to be found in dry caves.
The calcium nitrate was leached from the cave soil in vats, collected and then taken from the caves to be processed.
The first stage was to concentrate the solution using evaporation, generally using wood fires.
The concentrate was then reacted with potash (potassium carbonate, from the ashes of the wood fires used in the evaporation process). The calcium would be precipitated as calcium carbonate and would be replaced by the potassium in the solution to make potassium nitrate. The subsequent solution would be further "dried" by evaporation and the saltpetre crystals would remain.
The process is well documented and was primarily used to produce saltpetre for gunpowder, when the main source was denied.

I wonder who first thought that up?

Somebody with an understanding of basic chemistry at least.
The Chinese were using gunpowder in the 9th century so must have been extracting saltpetre from somewhere, although probably directly as potassium nitrate from guano, or something similar. As to who found out that there was calcium nitrate in cave earth, and how to convert it into potassium nitrate, in such a simple way, is anybodies guess...

 

[mikem]

From wikipedia:

Potassium nitrate was once thought to induce impotence, and is still falsely rumored to be in institutional food (such as military fare) as an anaphrodisiac; however, there is no scientific evidence for such properties