Substitute BMC for BCA and see what you think.....
http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=56766
I know what I think.....
http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=56766
I know what I think.....
Access
- Thread starter Hammy
- Start date
Pitlamp
Well-known member
In which case tell us what you think.
Having done a lot of climbing over the years I think the BMC does a good job in various ways.
I think the BMC had immense foresight (for example) in steering "competition" climbing away from natural crags and onto indoor climbing walls when it first started to become popular. I've always been very grateful that it took this stance.
Having done a lot of climbing over the years I think the BMC does a good job in various ways.
I think the BMC had immense foresight (for example) in steering "competition" climbing away from natural crags and onto indoor climbing walls when it first started to become popular. I've always been very grateful that it took this stance.
paul
Moderator
I think maybe Hammy is implying that the BCA shoule be as active as the BMC in ensuring access to caves?
One problem is that most estimates indicate there are about 6,000 cavers in the UK and about 60,000 climbers. This means the BMC carries a lot more "clout" with the "authorities". In some cases the BMC have taken ownership of crags in order to maintain access.
One problem is that most estimates indicate there are about 6,000 cavers in the UK and about 60,000 climbers. This means the BMC carries a lot more "clout" with the "authorities". In some cases the BMC have taken ownership of crags in order to maintain access.
graham
New member
paul said:
That 60,000 figure means that the BMC can afford to employ people like Elfyn Jones. The BCA cannot. Thus in caving these matters are dealt with at local level by volunteers. Anyone who reckons that they could do things better would probably be welcomed with open arms by their regional council.
jasonbirder
Member
Surely the issue is not there is an order of magnitude more climbers - which gives them more "clout"
But simply that its easier to fill in/blast a cave entrance than it is to demolish a crag...
But simply that its easier to fill in/blast a cave entrance than it is to demolish a crag...
jasonbirder
Member
Surely from an access point of view the Human created damage we're concerned about is that if we p*ss the landowner off...he can fill the entrance in with concrete/dead cows/barbed wire etc...Hence Cavers aren't as active about forcing access issues as climbers...
shortscotsman
New member
The BMC tends to only negotiate inclusive access whereas in caving people very often negotiate cave access
on an exclusive basis.
In caving the assumption seems to be that everyone outside ``bone-fide'' clubs will not conserve caves whereas everyone
in a club will. Neither assumptions seems good to me.
As a recent example, The PDCMG (access to Draenen) discussed whether to allow access to members of the BMC who were not club members and decided...
`` It was confirmed .....that the ethics of the CCC refer to Caving Clubs and therefore access should continue to be on a club basis only (individual membership of the BCA is not sufficient)''
This would appear bizarre in a climbing context.
on an exclusive basis.
In caving the assumption seems to be that everyone outside ``bone-fide'' clubs will not conserve caves whereas everyone
in a club will. Neither assumptions seems good to me.
As a recent example, The PDCMG (access to Draenen) discussed whether to allow access to members of the BMC who were not club members and decided...
`` It was confirmed .....that the ethics of the CCC refer to Caving Clubs and therefore access should continue to be on a club basis only (individual membership of the BCA is not sufficient)''
This would appear bizarre in a climbing context.
Bob Mehew
Well-known member
I quote from BCA's constitution
4. GUIDING PRINCIPLES:
4.7 That caving is an activity best pursued in a club environment and that the Association recommends individuals be members of a club.
and
11. LIMITATIONS:
11.1 The Association shall not interfere in the affairs of a Member unless specifically requested to do so by that Member.
:-\
4. GUIDING PRINCIPLES:
4.7 That caving is an activity best pursued in a club environment and that the Association recommends individuals be members of a club.
and
11. LIMITATIONS:
11.1 The Association shall not interfere in the affairs of a Member unless specifically requested to do so by that Member.
:-\
