Author Topic: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?  (Read 780 times)

Offline gingernutcrazy

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As an archaeologist, we like to push dates back... So after doing a bit of work to push back the age of DUSA (Formerly 1963, but now actually 1958!) I came across a University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS).
Does anyone have any information/journals on the old UCL club and what happened?
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Offline langcliffe

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2021, 10:15:24 pm »
I can't go back that far, but The Journal of the University of London University Caving Clubs was a joint effort by Chelsea College, Imperial College, Queen Mary College, and University College. I suspect that they go back to about 1964-1965. The earliest I have is April 1968 which was No. 6.

Offline gingernutcrazy

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2021, 10:18:13 pm »
I can't go back that far, but The Journal of the University of London University Caving Clubs was a joint effort by Chelsea College, Imperial College, Queen Mary College, and University College. I suspect that they go back to about 1964-1965. The earliest I have is April 1968 which was No. 6.

I will have to hunt one of those down! Currently I have a reference to it from the 1969 CNCC Handbook.
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Online PeteHall

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2021, 10:40:30 pm »
As an archaeologist, we like to push dates back... So after doing a bit of work to push back the age of DUSA (Formerly 1963, but now actually 1958!)

I believe the 1963 date was made up as an excuse for a 40th anniversary (shortly before I joined). I've heard 1958 mooted before, but is this now confirmed?

Offline gingernutcrazy

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2021, 10:44:15 pm »
As an archaeologist, we like to push dates back... So after doing a bit of work to push back the age of DUSA (Formerly 1963, but now actually 1958!)

I believe the 1963 date was made up as an excuse for a 40th anniversary (shortly before I joined). I've heard 1958 mooted before, but is this now confirmed?

Yeah the CNCC Handbook 1969 talks about DUCC (Durham University Caving Club) With a citation from 1958. Would make sense though as I suspect NUCC was founded from the split from Durham? Need to dig a bit deeper though!
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Offline thehungrytroglobite

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2021, 11:18:35 pm »
As an archaeologist, we like to push dates back... So after doing a bit of work to push back the age of DUSA (Formerly 1963, but now actually 1958!) I came across a University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS).
Does anyone have any information/journals on the old UCL club and what happened?

sounds like a rubbish club
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Offline JackSherlock

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2021, 11:23:46 pm »


Yeah the CNCC Handbook 1969 talks about DUCC (Durham University Caving Club) With a citation from 1958. Would make sense though as I suspect NUCC was founded from the split from Durham? Need to dig a bit deeper though!

Think the handbook reference is pretty definitive - should probably adopt this as the official date.
Time to update the stash!  :beer2:

Offline thehungrytroglobite

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2021, 11:51:58 pm »
As an archaeologist, we like to push dates back... So after doing a bit of work to push back the age of DUSA (Formerly 1963, but now actually 1958!)

I believe the 1963 date was made up as an excuse for a 40th anniversary (shortly before I joined). I've heard 1958 mooted before, but is this now confirmed?

Yeah the CNCC Handbook 1969 talks about DUCC (Durham University Caving Club) With a citation from 1958. Would make sense though as I suspect NUCC was founded from the split from Durham? Need to dig a bit deeper though!

Lol, NUCC is Nottingham. You can't even get the names right!
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Online PeteHall

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2021, 12:33:29 am »
I suspect all that really needs to happen is for someone to ask Andy Freem, as he was either a founding member of DUSA, or there within the first few years. I suspect it was him who mentioned 1958 to me, but I can't remember...
The other route would be to ask one of the other members from the sixties, who's brother was definitely a founding member, but hasn't caved for years. The trouble is I always end up pissed and forgetting the details when I meet up with these chaps...

Not that any of that helps you with UCLSS...

Offline thehungrytroglobite

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2021, 02:50:43 am »
As an archaeologist, we like to push dates back... So after doing a bit of work to push back the age of DUSA (Formerly 1963, but now actually 1958!) I came across a University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS).
Does anyone have any information/journals on the old UCL club and what happened?

This thread is a fine specimen of an archaeologist pretending to be a historian
Waffles are gooddddddd

Offline Pitlamp

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2021, 10:17:45 am »
I can't go back that far, but The Journal of the University of London University Caving Clubs was a joint effort by Chelsea College, Imperial College, Queen Mary College, and University College. I suspect that they go back to about 1964-1965. The earliest I have is April 1968 which was No. 6.

I highly recommend the series of caving journals which Langcliffe refers to above.

I'll send you a PM separately, with a bit of information which may indirectly help your query.

Online mikem

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2021, 10:48:03 am »
Some of London journals here:
https://www.union.ic.ac.uk/rcc/caving/pages/luccjournals.html

Obviously the Grampian seem to have the full set (1966 - 1973):
https://www.gsg.org.uk/node/687

UCLSS made it past 1972 (& also got mentioned in WSG bulletin 1983 & GSG journal 1985):
http://www.high-pasture-cave.org/index.php/the_cave/article/introduction

University of Newcastle CC had their 50th celebration in 2014, which would tie in with Durham's duff date...

Although, Durham's first journal apparently wasn't until 1977:
https://www.gsg.org.uk/node/646
« Last Edit: April 09, 2021, 11:18:44 am by mikem »

Offline Pitlamp

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #12 on: April 09, 2021, 11:31:44 am »
Really useful post MikeM. I've never seen any DUSA Journals - don't suppose they're online anywhere? (Can't see anything on DUSA's website.)

Online PeteHall

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #13 on: April 09, 2021, 11:52:29 am »
I've never seen any DUSA Journals

Neither have I and I was a member for 4 or 5 years...

If they exist, I suspect that they will be in a box in an attic in Newton Hall  :)

Online mikem

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #14 on: April 09, 2021, 12:05:56 pm »
Handbook isn't too easy to find on CNCC website, but there are 1969, 1979 & 1985 editions:
https://cncc.org.uk/about/history.php

BCL also lists a series of Handbooks produced during 1970s, but no info as to who by (7th entry; Cambrian also had one in 1969 & 1973):
http://caving-library.org.uk/catalogue/BCL/code/php/library.php?action=search&lib=BCL&type=any&search=title&search_string=Handbook

Here is the 1958 DUCC survey:
http://cavemaps.org/surveys/npc/full/NPC%20J59%20Crackpot%20Cave.png

Although the transcription of the article says DUEC (with Richmond School):
http://www.waddingtons.info/NPC/1959/CRACKPOT.HTM
« Last Edit: April 09, 2021, 12:23:27 pm by mikem »

Online mikem

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #15 on: April 09, 2021, 01:08:03 pm »
UCLSS are listed in 1979 handbook, but not 1985.

The WSG 1983 mention is only a library list (so I assume the Pindus exped report from 1967), so that just leaves the GSG entry in 3(5)p.21, August 1982 - but as that is "A short history of the GSG", it presumably refers to the 1972 discovery.

Online mikem

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #16 on: April 11, 2021, 10:30:13 am »
Of course, UCLSS's absence from 1985 handbook doesn't prove that they'd ceased to exist, but does indicate a loss of interest.

The earliest reference that I found to Durham uni & caving was 1957 (although no mention of a club, so seems fair to assume it was formed sometime around then):
http://www.waddingtons.info/NPC/1957/ALSTON.HTM

This was presumably Derek Maling, late of the FRCC, who was at Durham various times during 1940s & early 50s (obituary in):
https://www.frcc.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Vol26-3.pdf

Further info on him being shot down during WW2:
https://www.langleyadvancetimes.com/news/remembering-a-young-man-from-trail-who-went-to-war-and-never-came-home/
« Last Edit: April 11, 2021, 10:41:07 am by mikem »

Online PeteHall

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #17 on: April 14, 2021, 12:01:05 pm »
Really useful post MikeM. I've never seen any DUSA Journals - don't suppose they're online anywhere? (Can't see anything on DUSA's website.)

Former DUSA member Graham Veale has actually just finished digitising the one and only DUSA journal, which can be found here: https://1drv.ms/b/s!Am5fnjcUAjpxkFQBoUrNVN8px1ae?e=24PrUf

Offline Jenny P

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #18 on: April 14, 2021, 03:34:18 pm »
I can't go back that far, but The Journal of the University of London University Caving Clubs was a joint effort by Chelsea College, Imperial College, Queen Mary College, and University College. I suspect that they go back to about 1964-1965. The earliest I have is April 1968 which was No. 6.

The British Caving Library has a set of London Uni. C.C. Journals 1 to 14, 1966 to 1973 and ths appears to be the complete set.  No. 1 gives Tony Waltham (of Imperial College) as the person from whom you could obtain copies.

We also have a copy of the only DUSA journal produced from the early days, No. 1, 1977.  Although the club has re-formed and is active again, we don't have any later publications from them but would like to receive any which are produced.

Offline mrodoc

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Re: University College of London Speleo. Soc. (UCLSS) What happened?
« Reply #19 on: April 14, 2021, 07:31:29 pm »
I don't when it was formed but I did trips to Yorkshire and South Wales with them in the early 70's when I was at Barts.  I have quite a photos of the members then above and below ground. In the end we formed our own club as we were feeling more adventurous and they weren't brilliant on route finding at times.

 

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