Rope washing is a pain and does not seem too efficient pulling it back and forth.

Has anyone thoughts about adapting a pressure washer to do the job more efficiently than a normal rope washer  :-\

I understand that pressure washing of rope is inadvisable due to the significant ingress of abrading particles through the sheath.

but others claim this is an old wives tail Chris 

A Washing Machine 

Washing machine is OK but pressure washing is definitely a no-go, according to printed reference material - whether or not it is actually an old wives' tale is clearly debatable but I'm only passing on published information, not personal say-so/opinion/hunch.

To provide some context, the force in the jet of water for industrial pressure washers will cut through your feet let alone rope.  Admittedly the force in home pressure washers is much less, but the argument is that it could pressure "bad things" like grit through the sheath and into the core.  I also wonder about rope washers which use pulleys to run the rope back and forth for a similar reason.  (But then I find myself wondering about using abseiling devices on dirty rope.)  If grit does get into the core of the rope then the argument goes on to claim it will abrade yarns within the core as the rope extends and contracts.  No scientific evidence for this but it seems a reasonably sound argument.

The alternative used by some people is to use a washing machine.  Check your rope manufacturer's instructions but the likelihood is you can put the rope through a 30 degree wash and low spin without any serious harm to the rope (don't know about your washing machine however!).  For no seriously scientifically based reason (except the advice that one should keep rope cool), I can't say I like a 30 degree wash; I think a cold wash would be better.   

I made a washer a couple of years ago that works pretty well. It's basically a piece of 15mm copper tube with radial slots cut in it which is held inside a 22/22/15 Tee. The 15mm is sealed with reducers into the Tee, water from the hose goes into the centre of the Tee (which is effectively a jacket around the 15mm tube) and hence through the slots. The whole thing is inside some 40mm plastic waste pipe the ends of which are stuffed with sponge.

The rope runs through the sponge, through the 15mm tube where it is in close contact with the water and then out through more sponge. I fasten this to the washing line pole and pull the rope through it a few times - really muddy bits get a back-and-forwards pull until clean.

I'll maybe post some pics tomorrow.

Pressure washing is fine, it's a very common method to clean them. It's time consuming but it does the best job.

It's completely false about particles getting into it and damaging it, we've done tests. It actually makes the core cleaner if anything. =)

http://www.onrope1.com/mythbusters.htm

In particular: http://www.onrope1.com/Myth8.htm

Mr. Mythbuster #8 doesn't look very scientific to me. The advice to examine the rope closely is being done by someone wearing glasses whose head is a good metre away from the rope according to the photographs - any microscopic particles would surely be unseen in such circumstances.

If the rope is being powerwashed while resting on a tarpaulin/ground/etc. where does the gritty stuff go? - does it get "ker-pow-ed" straight through the rope, through the core and blasted out the other side and penetrated some depth into the ground?

I'm having trouble with my go-figuring.

A mate of mine made some very effective rope washers a while back, seemingly similar to the one TheBitterEnd  mentioned - a piece of stainless pipe with the ends slightly flared out and ends smoothed, and a hosepipe connection in the middle, and a couple of pieces of green plastic nylon doormat/astroturf material wrapped round the rope (like some of the commercial stream/bucket washers designed to be stood on),with one pushed into the pipe from either end.

The design ensures all the feed water runs through the pipe and beside the rope and keeps rinsing out removed material, and all the matting is used as the mud-rubbing material, unlike some traditional 'scrubbing brush' designs. Also, all the materials are rot-free - just stainless and plastic

A couple of welded-on rings allow for mounting to wall bolts with tape/string, and some string run through the backing part of the doormat material and tied on outside the pipe ends allow for easy removal and loss prevention.

Colour of water out of each end of the pipe is a good clue to the need to run through multiple times - if inlet water is slightly brown but outlet water clear, rope is done or nearly done.

The astroturf seems to stay basically clean even with the most horrifically clay/grit plastered ropes, and while it does wear, has a seriously good life. Our club hasn't replaced its original material yet, and has had its washer for well over 5 years.

Re seeking thoughts about more efficient >pressure washing< based rope cleaner, rather than conventional tap pressure, I can see an argument for the high pressure water jet forcing grit in towards the core as well as a view that it would wash it out by strong flushing. 

Does repeated dirty caving cause grit to migrate to the core as well as elsewhere in the cross section?

If we cave with dirty rope and potentially dirty core, would a domestic pressure washer used as a rope washer really affect rope strength during the relatively few years of its working life  :-\

Not convinced enough to begin to powerwash rope.  Just because you can't see any dirt in a small section of rope doesn't bust the 'myth'.  That section being cut off the end probably had less dirt initially as it's unlikely to have been abseiled or climbed on.  And if the particles are pushed through the rope, which they must be if the report of the cleaner core is to be believed, what about the damage their little sharp edges do on the way? 

Some of the other 'myths' 'busted' are as questionable.

Number 3 - suspension trauma is only an issue for the overweight?  A read of the literature would suggest that fitness is no indicator of an increased physiological resistance to suspension trauma. 

Number 18 - states that a karabiner gate will break if crossloaded with 85lbs (~0.4kN) force.  One of the more understandable statements in that myth bust - what does the following, 'Rope or webbing should never extend beyond 1 inch from the spine', mean?

I'll stick with a rope washer of the brush type until less controvertible evidence is published. 

Penguin said:

Number 18 - states that a karabiner gate will break if crossloaded with 85lbs (~0.4kN) force.  One of the more understandable statements in that myth bust - what does the following, 'Rope or webbing should never extend beyond 1 inch from the spine', mean?

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Assuming an offset D carabiner - force should be mainly transferred along the spine of the carabiner (the side without the gate). Force should be applied as close to this spine as possible.

Penguin said:

Not convinced enough to begin to powerwash rope.  Just because you can't see any dirt in a small section of rope doesn't bust the 'myth'.  That section being cut off the end probably had less dirt initially as it's unlikely to have been abseiled or climbed on.  And if the particles are pushed through the rope, which they must be if the report of the cleaner core is to be believed, what about the damage their little sharp edges do on the way? 

Some of the other 'myths' 'busted' are as questionable.

Number 3 - suspension trauma is only an issue for the overweight?  A read of the literature would suggest that fitness is no indicator of an increased physiological resistance to suspension trauma. 

Number 18 - states that a karabiner gate will break if crossloaded with 85lbs (~0.4kN) force.  One of the more understandable statements in that myth bust - what does the following, 'Rope or webbing should never extend beyond 1 inch from the spine', mean?

I'll stick with a rope washer of the brush type until less controvertible evidence is published.

Click to expand...

I'll try to find it but I know they've done further studies about it and you can look at it under a 'scrope and see it's fine.

Number 3 didn't say that no one else has harness hang, just that it can/often does affect the overweight much faster. =)

I will definitly agree that they don't really word/explain things well, I probably shouldn't have linked it A lot of stuff it's kinda...what? and then you realize they are talking about a specific situation. Like, that belay doesn't do anything - it does, but they were specifically saying using the 2nd rope causes issues in a confined environment which is totally different from a standard J-belay.

EDIT: here you go, much better test http://caveworthy.blogspot.com/2009/05/pressure-washing-rope.html

Although a bit more time consuming, the "pull through" brushes or astroturf type washer has these advantages:

It definitely won't cut fibres of the rope simply from the high velocity water jets. Gives you a reasonable feel and visual check of the ropes as you are doing it.

Strengthens your arms.

May force you to be sociable (and spend money buying beer to persuade helpers, instead of buying a pressure washer!)


I can't see how pressure washing could be that much quicker to be honest - you would need to rearange the "heap" or coils a few times to ensure all parts are washed. it would probably need to be suspended so it didn't lie in its own dirt  and then still be dirty when you pick it up. Or I'm I missing something?

Amy said:

EDIT: here you go, much better test http://caveworthy.blogspot.com/2009/05/pressure-washing-rope.html

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Many thanks - the article results in the conclusion that cleaning rope only really appears to aid its pliability for knot tieing and has nothing to do with keeping grit out of the inner core.

Amy said:

Number 3 didn't say that no one else has harness hang, just that it can/often does affect the overweight much faster. =)

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have a read of http://www.hse.gov.uk/research/crr_pdf/2002/crr02451.pdf followed by http://www.hse.gov.uk/falls/harness.htm.  The problem would seem to be ensuring you are not one of the 20%.   

have a read of http://www.hse.gov.uk/research/crr_pdf/2002/crr02451.pdf followed by http://www.hse.gov.uk/falls/harness.htm.  The problem would seem to be ensuring you are not one of the 20%. 

Click to expand...

Jesus wept ? all 110+ pages?

I always get the thick off (if they are really bad) in a large tub/trug, then daisy chain coil it up and bung in the washing machine on a short 30 deg wash with a very slow spin.  I usually put the machine on a rinse first to clear out residual detergents/softeners.

Comes out lovely and doesn't seem to knacker the machine.. I had 90m of 11mm in last week, top job. Slings etc also come out well.

My arms are getting weaker though  :-\

Having done serious damage to a pair of wellies with a jet washer, there's no way I would let one near my ropes, harnesses etc.

Rhys