Access/keys/gates for a footpath

[Christian_Chourot]

Disgression question:

Is there a significant difference between a motability scooter and a motorbike?

One can be a complete liability and is often driven without care...the other one is a motorbike.

While I agree that they are invaluable to some people, I think we should be checking that the users have enough marbles to use them, same as with motorbikes, mini ones, etc. etc. 5% of over 65s have dementia, rising to 20% of over 85s...not the people you want to be able to pull out into the road by accident.

But in terms of off road use on a foothpath, my first thought was a RADAR key too. In any case, have there actually been any problems with motorbikes at this location yet?

The problem is that local residents are fearful of motorbikes using the path

It appears not. Why do people try to solve problems that might not exist?

 

[Hughie]

I still think this is a case of over hyping/exaggerating the bad element who will ALWAYS get around barriers of some sort. Simply put a sign up saying no motor access or 10mph limit and let people get on with it. What tends to happen with these things is the solution becomes unworkable for all and pointless.

You cant control everything and its a given that criminals DONT obey rules and laws so making rules to TARGET criminals is crackers. Laws/Rules define a point at which a person becomes a criminal/bad person.

I think that's a very good point, DP.

An example I can think of is the banning of hand-guns (for target shooting) some years ago. Doesn't seem to have done much to help with gun crime (although I can't quote any figures, gun crime seems more rife than ever - unless that's a media portrayed perception). However, of course, gun crime could be considerably worse if pistols hadn't been banned

As an aside - if pistols are illegal in this country, where is the pistol shooting bit of the olympics going to be held in 2012?

Graham - I totally see your point, but I think your objectives will be incredibly difficult to achieve. It's tricky reasoning with an irrational minority.

 

[caving_fox]

"Is there a significant difference between a motability scooter and a motorbike?"

Yes.

Mobility scooter, is four wheeled, quiet and limited to 4-8mph. A motorbike is very noisy and not limited in speed except by the riders (lack of) ability and consideration for others. Other users of the green space won't be inconvenienced by the mobility scooters. Everyone is inconvienced by illegal motorbikes.

 

[graham]

Hughie, we don't reason with them, we fence them out & get Plod to confiscate & crush their bikes if they insist on remaining quite so anti-social.

 

[darkplaces]

Well its a fact that;

1. People think crime is rampant.

2. People are wrong and we live in the safest time in history and actually crime in relation to population (another topic) is very low.

Only our vastly tabloid media is very much focused on BAD stuff.

I actually don't see a problem with a path designed for mobility scooters to be also used for bikes. They are both motorised transport. Chavs will use the facility regardless. Actually the chavs will love to vandalized any kind of gate installed, so why give them a gate to vandalize in the first place. Make it boring and they wont want to hang around.

As an aside the hand gun topic - Figures released pre and post hand gun banning showed gun crime to be falling rapidly before the banning of hand guns and rising after the banning of hand guns. To me this clearly shows that banning hand guns was the worse step to take, before we had control and management, now we have no visibility.

 

[kay]

Just reread the OT.

Correct me if I'm wrong (which wouldn't be surprising!):

1) Pathway newly converted to allow access to motability scooters.
2) Local people concerned that motorbikes will enjoy using the new path.
3) Wheelchair users aren't bothered by the motorbikes.
4) You want to find a way to stop motorbikes but allow access to motability scooters.

Is this about right?

that's about right. Path was an ex-railway, been used as a path for years, but now tarmacked as an all-weather route, part of the 'safe routes to schools' initiative, which of course makes it ideal for mobility scooters.

Disgression question:

Is there a significant difference between a motability scooter and a motorbike?

speed, noise would be the main factors for other users of the path. Big difference between something moving at high speed that you can hear half a mile off, and something trundling at  a bit over walking pace with a quiet purr.

 

[kay]

wow actually I was shying away from posting and am happy to say the Cap has put a view forward better then I could have done.

I actually find it annoying to find these large mobility scooters blocking a whole pathway when really, they are big enough to be on the road.

I disagree quite strongly. They may be large, but they are low and not very visible.  I don't know what roads are like in your part of the world, but round here any user of a low speed, hard to manoeuvre vehicle in fast moving traffic on a busy road would be in considerable danger.

 

[kay]

I actually don't see a problem with a path designed for mobility scooters to be also used for bikes. They are both motorised transport.

By that logic, let's allow electric milk floats on to the M25

 

[graham]

I actually don't see a problem with a path designed for mobility scooters to be also used for bikes. They are both motorised transport.

By that logic, let's allow electric milk floats on to the M25

M25, average speed about 25 mph! A better example might be the M4 west of Reading. A mobility scooter in the middle lane might be just a touch on the  side.

 

[Rachel]

Ok then - here is an attempt at a sensible idea. How about putting in place something that deters speed rather than the size of the thing accessing the footpath.

Maybe speed bumps or something that a slow vehicle like a motorised wheelchair barely notices but a motorbike would have to slow down so often that they were no threat to other footpath users.

This sounds like a sensible idea. There are a lot of paths in the Dales that have narrow/awkward access that makes it impossible to get a toddler in a buggy through. I want my kids to grow up learning about and respecting the countryside, not being kept out of it because it's necessary to keep bikers out.

 

[ttxela]

As an aside - if pistols are illegal in this country, where is the pistol shooting bit of the olympics going to be held in 2012?

The secretary of state is going to use his powers under section 5 of the 1968 firearms act to grant an exemption to allow competitors to use MOD ranges.