The Old Ruminator
Well-known member
Just one of Vurley. Me looking for the safest route through the boulders.
Any New Finds?
- Thread starter Goydenman
- Start date
The Old Ruminator
Well-known member
Might see folks at Hidden Earth. You never know. 
martinb
Member
Always find reports of new finds interesting.
I/we are still not allowed (due to legalities :read to publicise our major find in Derbyshire Limestone made in April 2014.
It's a bit of a bummer, but that's how the cookie crumbles.
Mind you, saying that, we've got a write up and some nice photos for a forthcoming Descent - but at this rate it may be edition 497 or something silly!
I/we are still not allowed (due to legalities :read
to publicise our major find in Derbyshire Limestone made in April 2014.It's a bit of a bummer, but that's how the cookie crumbles.
Mind you, saying that, we've got a write up and some nice photos for a forthcoming Descent - but at this rate it may be edition 497 or something silly!
Pitlamp
Well-known member
The Old Ruminator wrote: "Personally I am not sure how a reluctance to publish new bits of cave here can be justified."
I've been mulling this comment over for a while and have a lot of empathy with this sentiment. But I thought at least some readers might appreciate my own take on the thought. In my case - which doesn't apply to all cavers of course - I belong to three good clubs (two in the Dales and one in the Peak District), each of which produces a high quality journal. I like to support this forum but I find myself torn between that and loyalty to my clubs. I'm involved in any number of exploration projects of course and these do come good and produce rewards. But I'm in the habit of writing stuff for journals, so I seldom get round to preparing exploration accounts for this fine forum.
Of course, this may be a good place for other cavers to advertise their finds. It would work well, for example, for a breakthrough by a co-operative group of cavers from several clubs (in which case it perhaps wouldn't be fair for a single club to have all publishing rights). Many clubs don't produce their own publications anyway, so their members have to look for other ways to record their discoveries.
I also like to try to support Descent magazine. Chris & Judith have done amazing things with this journal and we should all support it by providing them with material.
These are just my own thoughts; I appreciate many cavers are in different circumstances. But I've always tried to contribute to this forum in plenty of other ways, because those who do all the work to run this forum also deserve our support.
Maybe that at least gives part of the answer, Old Ruminator? I certainly enjoy reading the material you put on here.
I've been mulling this comment over for a while and have a lot of empathy with this sentiment. But I thought at least some readers might appreciate my own take on the thought. In my case - which doesn't apply to all cavers of course - I belong to three good clubs (two in the Dales and one in the Peak District), each of which produces a high quality journal. I like to support this forum but I find myself torn between that and loyalty to my clubs. I'm involved in any number of exploration projects of course and these do come good and produce rewards. But I'm in the habit of writing stuff for journals, so I seldom get round to preparing exploration accounts for this fine forum.
Of course, this may be a good place for other cavers to advertise their finds. It would work well, for example, for a breakthrough by a co-operative group of cavers from several clubs (in which case it perhaps wouldn't be fair for a single club to have all publishing rights). Many clubs don't produce their own publications anyway, so their members have to look for other ways to record their discoveries.
I also like to try to support Descent magazine. Chris & Judith have done amazing things with this journal and we should all support it by providing them with material.
These are just my own thoughts; I appreciate many cavers are in different circumstances. But I've always tried to contribute to this forum in plenty of other ways, because those who do all the work to run this forum also deserve our support.
Maybe that at least gives part of the answer, Old Ruminator? I certainly enjoy reading the material you put on here.
The Old Ruminator
Well-known member
Agree totally Pitlamp. I would like to think, though, that wherever one's priorities lies it comes before Facebook.
Facebook is good for many things caving, however what the forum does better is enable cavers to search its archives and find information more easily. Try looking up a dig report you may have read about 3 years ago by someone on facebook - good luck with that. If you are struggling to find something on the forum, someone on here will be able to help you. The depth of knowledge still astounds me...
A post on facebook does not reach everyone - goodness knows how facebook decides what you see and what you don't - it's a subtle difference, however I believe cavers visit the forum looking for information and will search out what interests them whereas on facebook posts appear on your timeline whether you are interested or not....apart of course from the posts from UKC which surely are a must read
Between 650 and 1000+ cavers a day visit UKC and digging/trip reports are firm favourites - so go on, tell your fellow cavers about your adventures rather than just support facebook which cares nothing about cavers, caving and caves??
Pegasus
A post on facebook does not reach everyone - goodness knows how facebook decides what you see and what you don't - it's a subtle difference, however I believe cavers visit the forum looking for information and will search out what interests them whereas on facebook posts appear on your timeline whether you are interested or not....apart of course from the posts from UKC which surely are a must read
Between 650 and 1000+ cavers a day visit UKC and digging/trip reports are firm favourites - so go on, tell your fellow cavers about your adventures rather than just support facebook which cares nothing about cavers, caving and caves??
Pegasus
Goydenman said:
Goydenman, honestly it's not hard to post photos once you have the hang of it, blimey if I can do it anyone can! (said the Luddite). Don't use photobucket (bastards) for third party hosting or facebook (as photos soon disappear).
Check out this thread: https://ukcaving.com/board/index.php?topic=19799.0 on how to post photos.
If I can be of any more help let me know - we would love to see your digs reported here, especially if there are photos
The Old Ruminator
Well-known member
My 100th dig in Vurley today. Not bad in two and a half years for someone over 70. Can't write any more as I have to lie down.
Might find a photo later ---
Oh Yes. Using Postimage currently which is easy to use.
Might find a photo later ---
Oh Yes. Using Postimage currently which is easy to use.
TheBitterEnd
Well-known member
The Old Ruminator said:
Well done!
Kenilworth
New member
Pitlamp said:
I too have thought a lot about this. While I agree with both of you, another truth does exist. In most cases there is no obligation to report on any trip or discovery. Sometimes acceptance of a grant or permit creates a commitment to report, otherwise it's the decision of the caver(s) doing the work. Some do not like to write and feel no need to gloat over their discoveries. Others are competitive and secretive. Others wait for a neverending project to be finished. Whatever the case, we can't really complain about a lack of reporting. They don't owe us anything. I say this despite my strong belief in the value of thorough and accessible (not necessarily easily) documentation.
If I may add some personal boasting, my own exploration has been both successful and interesting lately. When I was an NSS member and the NSS forum was active, I used to write straightforward and detailed trip reports for club publications or the NSS News, and semi-poetic narratives for the forum. I have continued to write in both styles, but having no suitable means to publish incrementally am organizing this material into a second book. I feel sure it will be unique, including original data, maps, trip reports, sketches, statistics, essays, interviews, poetry, historical and geographical profiles, and photographs within a single volume. Whether or not it will be good is a bigger question.
Pitlamp
Well-known member
There's nothing in your first paragraph above (Kenilworth) that I can disagree with.
I'm aware of at least one lengthy cave in my own favourite caving area which has never been reported anywhere, because the discoverers have (commendably) stuck to the undertaking they gave not to, when they were allowed access originally.
People have all sorts of valid reasons for when, where and how often they tell the rest of the caving community about their work and resulting successes. At the end of the day, that's their decision of course.
The only really lousy reason for not reporting is laziness.
I'm aware of at least one lengthy cave in my own favourite caving area which has never been reported anywhere, because the discoverers have (commendably) stuck to the undertaking they gave not to, when they were allowed access originally.
People have all sorts of valid reasons for when, where and how often they tell the rest of the caving community about their work and resulting successes. At the end of the day, that's their decision of course.
The only really lousy reason for not reporting is laziness.
pwhole
Well-known member
Another interesting variant can be somewhere like JH, which has 'become' a Scheduled Monument since it was first entered, merely by dint of being beneath a Scheduling zone intended only for preserving surface works - and so any 'exploration' that involves even moving rocks (or drilling bolts!) now is technically classed as 'damage', and any permission to work can only be granted by the Secretary of State. I had an interesting logic discussion over this with EH, and the team have regularly discussed whether ever to publish our explorations in there as a result, but we're going to shortly. They can come and drag me away in chains if they must.
Not only that, but the Speedwell streamway meanders in and out of the Scheduling zone, so you can dig on this bend, but not that one... :read:
Not only that, but the Speedwell streamway meanders in and out of the Scheduling zone, so you can dig on this bend, but not that one... :read:
A scheduling authority (EH, Cadw, etc) can word the scheduling instrument to limit depth or to exclude certain aspects of the subsurface. This flexibility permitted numerous collieries in C20 to work beneath scheduled monuments and continues to permit some current mining operations to work beneath scheduled monuments.
Scheduling doesn't have to extend to the centre of the Earth - but it requires some careful thought on the part of the scheduling authority when framing the relevant documents.
Scheduling doesn't have to extend to the centre of the Earth - but it requires some careful thought on the part of the scheduling authority when framing the relevant documents.
Leclused
Active member
Yesterday the team at the PSM/Anialarra pushed our new find (Sima Regalo) from -140m to -200m Stopped above next pitch (20-30m deep) due to pitch-entrance too small. But that will be solved today if the weather allows it.
The team had a lot of snow and rain and the forecast is not very good for the week-end. Again snow and rain
Follow them (and me from saterday on) via FB : https://www.facebook.com/groups/1362549833863322/
Stopped above next pitch (20-30m deep) due to pitch-entrance too small. But that will be solved today if the weather allows it.The team had a lot of snow and rain and the forecast is not very good for the week-end. Again snow and rain
Follow them (and me from saterday on) via FB : https://www.facebook.com/groups/1362549833863322/
The Old Ruminator
Well-known member
Leclused said:Yesterday the team at the PSM/Anialarra pushed our new find (Sima Regalo) from -140m to -200m
The team had a lot of snow and rain and the forecast is not very good for the week-end. Again snow and rain
Follow them (and me from saterday on) via FB : https://www.facebook.com/groups/1362549833863322/
Facebook can be more relevant if links are posted here on the forum. Likewise the same applies to blogs. I did a list of Facebook Groups relevant to my collecting hobby on our bottle forum. Surprisingly there were dozens world wide and if you include photography you would find the same for caving. Sadly many Facebook Groups are closed and you have to join to see content. Our Mendip diggers group works like that though I must say you can probably guess who the biggest contributor is. Yes the shear volume of groups dilutes the information to an impossible point to assimilate. This blog is one of the best for Mendip and " open " not " closed " like our own site.
http://www.dighalloween.mendipgeoarch.net/#home
