Cave rescue
- Thread starter Cavegod
- Start date
JB
Member
Definitive info about how to call out cave rescue is at: http://www.caverescue.org.uk/ then click on 'How Cave Rescue Works'.
Where it says "If you need the assistance of a cave rescue team you should dial 999 and ask for the police then for Cave Rescue."
Is this what you did?
If so, sounds like a bit of training is needed in the emergency services control rooms. I'm sure that if everything's working right it's better going the 999 route than phoning the police switchboard number (that's for non-emergencies right?). If you haven't already I'd suggest contacting the CRO controller and letting him/her know your concerns.
Jules.
Where it says "If you need the assistance of a cave rescue team you should dial 999 and ask for the police then for Cave Rescue."
Is this what you did?
If so, sounds like a bit of training is needed in the emergency services control rooms. I'm sure that if everything's working right it's better going the 999 route than phoning the police switchboard number (that's for non-emergencies right?). If you haven't already I'd suggest contacting the CRO controller and letting him/her know your concerns.
Jules.
Most problems occur when the caller dials 999 and asks for 'Cave Rescue'. Despite what the telephone directories say the 999 call centres seem unable to handle this and will frequently misroute calls, often putting you through to the coastguard or fire and rescue services.
In the UK to call out Cave Rescue dial 999 (or 112) and ask for POLICE. Only when speaking to the police control room should you ask for Cave Rescue assistance.
If this is what you did and there were still problems please let me know.
Tom
In the UK to call out Cave Rescue dial 999 (or 112) and ask for POLICE. Only when speaking to the police control room should you ask for Cave Rescue assistance.
If this is what you did and there were still problems please let me know.
Tom
Hatstand
New member
Thats all well and good but if you consider that the system needs to be numpty proof (yes even I go caving sometimes) and that in times of stress even the most experienced folks are known to go a bit to pot the system needs to be as simple as "999" "HELP! Cave Rescue!"
But then the Cave Rescue dudes are bound to know this and I would guess bang their heads raw trying to get it through to the 999 people... [sympathy mode: ON]
But then the Cave Rescue dudes are bound to know this and I would guess bang their heads raw trying to get it through to the 999 people... [sympathy mode: ON]
ronaldjprice
New member
Several weeks ago I dialled 999 asked for the police gave an 8 Figure grid reference and the operator continually told me she could not initiate cave rescue, fortunately I knew to stay by the phone as the operator had not asked me to, or read back the ngr when C.R.O. turned up after calling me back to confirm location, and said the operator had complained to them that I was rude to her!
The sheep was happy it did not end up at the bottom of Turbury Pot.
The police said they would get back to me about my complaint...............still waiting
If at first you don't succeed call back get a different operator
The sheep was happy it did not end up at the bottom of Turbury Pot.
The police said they would get back to me about my complaint...............still waiting
If at first you don't succeed call back get a different operator
Cave_Troll
Active member
there are efforts to educate call centre staff.
unfortunately the number of calls the deal with that are not fire/police/ambulance are very small
some figures:
across the entire Peak district, there are probably something less than 500 calls for mountain/cave rescue every year. Derbyshire police get somewhere around 3000 calls per day. add on to that a similar number for ambulance and we come out at a very small percentage.
I once responded to a kid stuck on a ledge . he;d called 999 and been told "we don't do mountain rescue on this number go away". being a resourceful young lad he dialled 112 and got a different operator who was a bit more sympathetic.
each time a problem like this happens, the local MR org does try and raise it. the local police may be on the ball, but its probably a call centre operator in Basingstoke that needs educating. there are efforts at a national level to do that.
unfortunately the number of calls the deal with that are not fire/police/ambulance are very small
some figures:
across the entire Peak district, there are probably something less than 500 calls for mountain/cave rescue every year. Derbyshire police get somewhere around 3000 calls per day. add on to that a similar number for ambulance and we come out at a very small percentage.
I once responded to a kid stuck on a ledge . he;d called 999 and been told "we don't do mountain rescue on this number go away". being a resourceful young lad he dialled 112 and got a different operator who was a bit more sympathetic.
each time a problem like this happens, the local MR org does try and raise it. the local police may be on the ball, but its probably a call centre operator in Basingstoke that needs educating. there are efforts at a national level to do that.
In a tehcnical, and very unhelpful, way are they not corrent in saying "we don't do mountin rescue"? You need to ask for the police, who then call out the mountain rescue. Similarly you need to ask for the coastguard on 999 to get a lifeboat out.
The police are the 999 service that manages the call so if it was me I would just ask the 999 operator for the police, then ask them for the CRO.
I know that that the 999 operator ought to know about other resources, but I believe they would only ever route a call for the CRO to the police anyway.
The police are the 999 service that manages the call so if it was me I would just ask the 999 operator for the police, then ask them for the CRO.
I know that that the 999 operator ought to know about other resources, but I believe they would only ever route a call for the CRO to the police anyway.
paul
Moderator
And sometimes you get more than you bargained for! See Incident 281 on the DCRO Callouts Page...
Bob Mehew
Well-known member
As they meet 10 miles down the road from where I live, I sit on the Inland Consultative Committee of the UK Search and Rescue, see http://www.dft.gov.uk/transportforyou/uksar/ . It has been a while since this topic came up, so could any one who has recent poor experience with 999 calls PM me with their experiences. I can raise it through the committee and whilst I am not promising to rectify the problem, if one does nothing then it sure ain't going to go away!ronaldjprice said:
Peter Burgess
New member
What kind of rescue team has to rely on borrowing kit from the victim's colleagues? At least Cave Rescue Teams are pretty much self-reliant! I know this was nine years ago, but treat this as a lesson. If you are not involved in your local cave rescue team, then give it some careful thought. The more cavers help themselves, the better.
Cave_Troll
Active member
it still happens.
there was a callout on a local climbing crag recently.
the first Mountain Rescue knew was the local retained fire engine going past the team fundraising waiving.
then we got a phone call from another team member who happened to be stood next to the local fire chief at a local event. "havn't you guys been called out"?
long story short.
Local retained crew Fire Engine
Rope rescue Unit Fire Engine
Rope rescue unit land rover
Fire officer in own car with blue light (to look after the Rope rescue)
fire officer 2 in his car with blue light (to look after the 1st officer)
Ambulance
Rapid response Paramedic car
local Basics Doc on Blues
Mountain rescue land rover x 2
I was first MR on scene to find a bloke sat up with his head being held by his mate on FB O2. the FB were just stood the with a look that said "he's not on fire... what next?"
there was a callout on a local climbing crag recently.
the first Mountain Rescue knew was the local retained fire engine going past the team fundraising waiving.
then we got a phone call from another team member who happened to be stood next to the local fire chief at a local event. "havn't you guys been called out"?
long story short.
Local retained crew Fire Engine
Rope rescue Unit Fire Engine
Rope rescue unit land rover
Fire officer in own car with blue light (to look after the Rope rescue)
fire officer 2 in his car with blue light (to look after the 1st officer)
Ambulance
Rapid response Paramedic car
local Basics Doc on Blues
Mountain rescue land rover x 2
I was first MR on scene to find a bloke sat up with his head being held by his mate on FB O2. the FB were just stood the with a look that said "he's not on fire... what next?"
C
Clive G
Guest
It's what's called "horses for courses . . ."
A few years ago there was an ambulance-drivers' strike and the Police stepped in to fill the gap.
As I walked down Wallwood Street, London E14, I saw a crowd of people gathered around a youth lying in the road who had a broken leg. It sounded as if he had been grabbed by someone from a moving car and then dragged along the street until he collapsed, injured.
A blanket was brought out to the casualty from a nearby house and someone made a '999' call for an 'ambulance' . . .
The Police duly arrived in a white transit van (no windows along the sides of the rear compartment) and opened the rear doors. There was what looked like a WW2-vintage canvas-and-timber stretcher lying on the metal floor - and that was about it inside.
However, before the stretcher was pulled out, several minutes of interrogation ensued. The youth's foreign-sounding Christian name had a 'Mr' added in front of it and then he was quizzed at depth to establish that he really was the person who he claimed to be - "Had he got identification to prove it?" - and "Where was he from?" You could see that the Police officer asking the questions wasn't believing a word of it. The youth was then challenged to stand up and stop messing around. I seem to recall that at this point one of the bystanders interjected and pointed out, with a degree of consternation, the angle at which the youth's leg had been bent - indicating that it was broken - and that it wouldn't be a good idea for him to get up.
I guess that's what task-specific training does for you. And I'm sure the Police officers concerned didn't particularly want to be doing ambulance duty, anyway.
It's what's called "horses for courses . . ."
A few years ago there was an ambulance-drivers' strike and the Police stepped in to fill the gap.
As I walked down Wallwood Street, London E14, I saw a crowd of people gathered around a youth lying in the road who had a broken leg. It sounded as if he had been grabbed by someone from a moving car and then dragged along the street until he collapsed, injured.
A blanket was brought out to the casualty from a nearby house and someone made a '999' call for an 'ambulance' . . .
The Police duly arrived in a white transit van (no windows along the sides of the rear compartment) and opened the rear doors. There was what looked like a WW2-vintage canvas-and-timber stretcher lying on the metal floor - and that was about it inside.
However, before the stretcher was pulled out, several minutes of interrogation ensued. The youth's foreign-sounding Christian name had a 'Mr' added in front of it and then he was quizzed at depth to establish that he really was the person who he claimed to be - "Had he got identification to prove it?" - and "Where was he from?" You could see that the Police officer asking the questions wasn't believing a word of it. The youth was then challenged to stand up and stop messing around. I seem to recall that at this point one of the bystanders interjected and pointed out, with a degree of consternation, the angle at which the youth's leg had been bent - indicating that it was broken - and that it wouldn't be a good idea for him to get up.
I guess that's what task-specific training does for you. And I'm sure the Police officers concerned didn't particularly want to be doing ambulance duty, anyway.
It's what's called "horses for courses . . ."
Slug
Member
Poor lads lucky that questioned was all he got.... he could have been treated by this officer
http://www.boreme.com/boreme/funny-2009/police-medic-p1.php
http://www.boreme.com/boreme/funny-2009/police-medic-p1.php
ronaldjprice
New member
Having brought the matter to the attention of the Police earlier on this year.
The Police called me back today having looked into two of the incidents above (Hammer pot & Turbury pot ), they have been working with C.R.O. and made some improvements in their call operating and mapping systems, so hopefully some improvement will be seen.
But as before if you don't get the required response, call back as a different operator whom may be more experienced may be better able to help.
As mentioned above if you have a bad experience, bring it to the attention of the police control room staff, if they are not aware of problems they wont address them.
Above all try to remain polite, calm and collected.
Ron
The Police called me back today having looked into two of the incidents above (Hammer pot & Turbury pot ), they have been working with C.R.O. and made some improvements in their call operating and mapping systems, so hopefully some improvement will be seen.
But as before if you don't get the required response, call back as a different operator whom may be more experienced may be better able to help.
As mentioned above if you have a bad experience, bring it to the attention of the police control room staff, if they are not aware of problems they wont address them.
Above all try to remain polite, calm and collected.
Ron
