Cows tails

[angelmaz11]

I have just bought a brand new SRT kit and was wondering whether someone could give me advice on Cows tails. Basically I'm being lazy and don't want to read a book, lame I know.

So my questions are, how do you know what the right length is? Is there some way of measuring it according to my height, or is it a matter of guessing?? There must be a way of measuring it, just like with the footloop.

Thanks!

 

[Stu]

I have just bought a brand new SRT kit and was wondering whether someone could give me advice on Cows tails. Basically I'm being lazy and don't want to read a book, lame I know.

So my questions are, how do you know what the right length is? Is there some way of measuring it according to my height, or is it a matter of guessing?? There must be a way of measuring it, just like with the footloop.

Thanks!

How long's a piece of string? There's recommended and I guess there's preference. IMHO the long tail should be just within reach when it's being loaded (if that makes sense). Which in real terms when unloaded puts the top of the krab at about top of my head height. The short tail I have to about chin height (krab included).

 

[potholer]

Always remember that the lengths increase as the knots tighten, so particularly if you want a short short, you have to tie it *really* short, and/or tighten up one of the knots on it before tying the second - some fixed object, an crab, tape and a handled jammer can be useful for that.
One thing it might be worth doing for *next* time is measuring the lengths of your cowstails after hand-tightening and after proper tightening. If you want to change the lengths the next time you tie a set, you'll have some idea what to expect of the final lengths.

As Stu says - it's very much a matter of preference. The long should be reachable when you're hanging on it, but not hugely shorter than that.
For technical SRT (especially if people tie rebelay loops on the short side, a fairly short short can be handy, but not *so* short that it's a pain to clip into knots.
For high traverse lines, a longer short can often be useful, so it does come down to some kind of compromise.

It's probably best to tie something like your local knowledgable caver seems to use, and then while you're using them, keep thinking about whether things might be harder or easier with different lengths next time.

 

[joncaverdevon]

Our friend potholer say's "The long should be reachable" I think he meant to say "The long MUST be reachable" even when fully loaded.

Otherwise you will become one of those numbers in the British Cave Rescue annual report - I can see the title "Hung Up"

Safe Caving

 

[potholer]

Well, though mine is short enough to reach, if you're hanging off your long cowstail, and there's nowhere to stand (to unload it), it's debatable whether it matters *precisely* how long it is - you can't undo it when you're hanging on it anyway. If there *is* somewhere to stand, you could probably climb up an inch or two, so I don't think there's a sharp cutoff between OK and too long - in practice for ropework, the issue is usually one of of noticing it's *about* to go tight before it really does so in situations such as having the long cowstail as a safety for the start of a descent section.

 

[JB]

Well, though mine is short enough to reach, if you're hanging off your long cowstail, and there's nowhere to stand (to unload it), it's debatable whether it matters *precisely* how long it is - you can't undo it when you're hanging on it anyway.

It's quite nice to have a longish long cowstail cos you can protect yourself and still move about a bit. As you say, if you were hanging on a traverse line you couldn't unclip it anyway even if you could reach it (and why would you want to?) I think the best argument for keeping the krab on your long cowstail within reach is that if your krab's in reach, then presumably the traverse line is also in reach. If your feet popped off and you were hanging you could pull back up on the traverse line rather than trying to climb up your own cowstail (which would be about UK tech 4c but very well protected!)

 

[tubby two]

to climb up your own cowstail (which would be about UK tech 4c but very well protected!)

Surely it's only an exceedingly safe tech 1a with that magic little device called a jammer and footloop!

tt.

p.s. still should be just in reach or every time you forget to unclip when moving along its in reach to get off.

 

[MSD]

A reasonable rule of thumb is that when you have your harness on with your your cowsrails attached:

The crab of the short cowstail shoud fall into your hand if you stretch it away from you with your elbow held against the body.

The crab of your long couwstail should be about eye level if you stretch it upwards.

Mark

 

[cap n chris]

MSD - thanks, that's neat and easy to remember!

 

[Dave H]

I run with one at arms length when loaded and one just under chin height. As I've always seen prescribed.

But when I'm doing pitches where there is little or nowhere to put your feet at changeover I also use a cowstail so short that the knots almost touch each other. (I'm thinking of places like the change-over on the overhanging edge of the Dihederal route in GG, where your feet are swinging in the wind. Long cowstail in the loop of rope from above, short cowstail in a bolt and tiny cowstail in the loop of the knot)

Before you ask why, I'm not totally sure, I've always done it that way.

 

[danthecavingman]

My short is very short, easy to get of bolts that way.
My long is just long enough that I can reach the krab when fully extended.
If I need an inbetween I use my jammer / safety cord.
Having an etrier handy is useful as well for awkward pitch heads / rebelays.