CRTT Updates

SamMil

SamMil

New member
C9C Completed the CRTT extreme and normal routes this weekend.

Both ropes on the original 2 pitches have been replaced as both had wear with isolation knots.

The second traverse on the extreme route (across the air shaft) had significant damage to the outer sheath. Unfortunately we didn’t have any spare rope to replace this. It is still passable with care.

The boat is currently operational on a to me to you system, take care when using it, and if you are the last party to cross, do not use the pulley to bring the boat back to you, as when you journey across there is a couple knots that will get stuck in the pulley. Instead pull the rope straight up.

Merry Christmas all
 
SamMil

SamMil

New member
Additional to this, some lowlife has removed the hanger from the sole expansion bolt on the bolt climb out of the boat.
At the time the bolter ran out of resin bolts hence the expansion. I shall endeavour to return again soon with some shiny new bolts to replace this.
In the meantime it should still be doable, just a tad more tricky
 
speedycaver

speedycaver

New member
I have just received a report from someone who has just completed the 'Extreme High Level' route. All rigging is good and solid but the boat in the Chamber of Horrors was stuck and the pull-through rope was broken.
This boat crossing has been nothing but a nuisance since the canoe was put in due to people not understanding how to use the pull-through system or the rope simply breaking. Currently, anyone attempting the trip will need to take their own inflatable boat.
Never assume the canoe will never be useable, always take a boat with you.

And don't leave your boat in that chamber, take it with you! We do not want to have to clear dead boats from that chamber again.

Further updates are always welcome on here. (y)
 
T

TunnelWade

New member
We might be popping up there in the next day or two. We will take a look. We had planned on making a few adjustments here and there on the traverses. We added in a few bolts last time. As for the boat...nothing wrong with a good evening swim. But we will see if we can rectify it.
 
Cantclimbtom

Cantclimbtom

Well-known member
Oh No! not another callout??

I note that as well as stuck canoe shenanigans :) (part of the "charm", bring your own) the time they would've been in Rhosydd section from callout times etc -- versus winter sunset times, they'd have been trying to navigate Rhosydd at night.

As someone who first went through it at *night* with another person who was unfamiliar with the route also that key features such as the "daylight chambers" are not at all obvious because they're all as dark as each other :) Despite having a couple of different versions of route instructions (but crucially *not* the Croesor or Rhosydd surveys/plan - idiot Tom! Never again) the route finding was not at all obvious without hindsight and we had to retrace the short distance to the wall section (H6) and systematically try again. The squeeze in collapsed "tunnel" (into E6? up the big block/boulder slope and back down the other side) wasn't obvious to us first time, even though next time it was unmissably obvious on retry and more thorough inspection

Yes, it would dumb it down and make even more of a tourist trap, therefore possibly counter productive? (it's not go-below!) but I think that single measure would greatly reduce the late exit causing callouts, maybe by 50% would be putting a "CRTT this way sign" just before that squeeze. I shudder to even suggest that (it's historically disrespectful), but would that be any worse than any of the other aids added? And it might stop a ****** ***** person with a can of spray paint doing something similar one day :(

Dunno, so easy with hindsight and say: people should do this and should do that. But a first trip during dark, is going to trip some people up (the ones without copies of the plans)
 
thehungrytroglobite

thehungrytroglobite

Well-known member
Cantclimbtom said:
Oh No! not another callout??

I note that as well as stuck canoe shenanigans :) (part of the "charm", bring your own) the time they would've been in Rhosydd section from callout times etc -- versus winter sunset times, they'd have been trying to navigate Rhosydd at night.

As someone who first went through it at *night* with another person who was unfamiliar with the route also that key features such as the "daylight chambers" are not at all obvious because they're all as dark as each other :) Despite having a couple of different versions of route instructions (but crucially *not* the Croesor or Rhosydd surveys/plan - idiot Tom! Never again) the route finding was not at all obvious without hindsight and we had to retrace the short distance to the wall section (H6) and systematically try again. The squeeze in collapsed "tunnel" (into E6? up the big block/boulder slope and back down the other side) wasn't obvious to us first time, even though next time it was unmissably obvious on retry and more thorough inspection

Yes, it would dumb it down and make even more of a tourist trap, therefore possibly counter productive? (it's not go-below!) but I think that single measure would greatly reduce the late exit causing callouts, maybe by 50% would be putting a "CRTT this way sign" just before that squeeze. I shudder to even suggest that (it's historically disrespectful), but would that be any worse than any of the other aids added? And it might stop a ****** ***** person with a can of spray paint doing something similar one day :(

Dunno, so easy with hindsight and say: people should do this and should do that. But a first trip during dark, is going to trip some people up (the ones without copies of the plans)
Click to expand...
I don't know, it would set a weird precedent for other situations. Do we then put a sign in the Cwm Dwr choke? In OFD? In Mistral? In any other place people have gotten lost? I know mines are a bit different because they're already man made, and I've seen arrows in other mines too, so maybe I shouldn't be thinking about it from a cavers perspective
 
M

mikem

Well-known member
If it's somewhere regular callouts occur then the rescue team will highlight it to save themselves the hassle
 
Babyhagrid

Babyhagrid

Well-known member
thehungrytroglobite said:
I don't know, it would set a weird precedent for other situations. Do we then put a sign in the Cwm Dwr choke? In OFD? In Mistral? In any other place people have gotten lost? I know mines are a bit different because they're already man made, and I've seen arrows in other mines too, so maybe I shouldn't be thinking about it from a cavers perspective
Click to expand...
Theres two signs in prices prophesy in Daren cilau that sends people towards ogof cwnc. After lots of people got lost on the thru trip
 
Cantclimbtom

Cantclimbtom

Well-known member
thehungrytroglobite said:
I don't know, it would set a weird precedent for other situations. Do we then put a sign in the Cwm Dwr choke? In OFD? In Mistral? In any other place people have gotten lost? I know mines are a bit different because they're already man made, and I've seen arrows in other mines too, so maybe I shouldn't be thinking about it from a cavers perspective
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I thought cavers were the ones with signs, isn't there a big roadsign pointing to Wookey Hole (avoiding city centre) in one cave? ;)
 
langcliffe

langcliffe

Well-known member
The French waymark popular routes. The reflective tape strips in PSM are very useful, and don't have a major impact on the cave.
 
thehungrytroglobite

thehungrytroglobite

Well-known member
I also am confused about why they couldn't prusik out. Every caver / mine explorer with common sense knows to bring up gear on a through trip that you haven't done before / don't definitely know they way out of. Even if it's just a small tibloc that could be used in conjunction with a stop or traditional prusik - light to carry, a bit inconvenient to use but would get you out of the situation
Cantclimbtom said:
I thought cavers were the ones with signs, isn't there a big roadsign pointing to Wookey Hole (avoiding city centre) in one cave? ;)
Click to expand...
not that I'm aware of, but that might be because I'm never in the south!
 
thehungrytroglobite

thehungrytroglobite

Well-known member
thehungrytroglobite said:
I also am confused about why they couldn't prusik out. Every caver / mine explorer with common sense knows to bring up gear on a through trip that you haven't done before / don't definitely know they way out of. Even if it's just a small tibloc that could be used in conjunction with a stop or traditional prusik - light to carry, a bit inconvenient to use but would get you out of the situation

not that I'm aware of, but that might be because I'm never in the south!
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I deleted the above text after typing it out but for some reason UKC still posted it and now it seems that I can't delete it. I had completely misread the Facebook post from NWCRO so my statement is entirely void and unnecessary. Please ignore it
 
cavemanmike

cavemanmike

Well-known member
I can’t understand why people go underground if (a) they don’t know the way out(take a topo/map)
(B) they are unsure of the system they are in
(Take someone with you who’s done it before)
Its not rocket science (really)🙄🙄🙄
 
C

ChrisB

Active member
so my statement is entirely void and unnecessary
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It made sense to me. Perhaps I've misread the NWCRO post the same way? I understood it to mean they were rescued from the bottom of a pitch they couldn't ascend because they didn't have the gear.
 
Cantclimbtom

Cantclimbtom

Well-known member
It says they couldn't find the way through Rhosydd and decided to reverse. It says they were unprepared to ascend ropes... but it also says they were found at the bottom of the first pitch which means they'd managed to ascend the second pitch and cross the unstable/big chamber.
 
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