Doncaster Dolomite limestone

[richardg]

For a while I will be based in Doncaster....... I know there are some interesting documented and visited caves in the dolomite limestone of the region ........ as well as  the possibility for much more,  including the potential for the discovery and Exploration of so far unexplored stream caves.

I'm putting this post up to see if there is anyone else interested in finding a way into these caves, who may like to link up.

Richard.

 

[mch]

Hi Richard

Interesting thought, stream caves in dolomite. Clearly rainwater sinks therein but I don't know of anything flowing off the adjacent impermeable geology and sinking in the dolomite or resurging therefrom. Having said that I haven't done an exhaustive study. I live in Doncaster so would certainly be interested in anything you have in mind.

Mike

 

[martinb]

I've done a bit of research into Magnesian/Dolomitic Caves - somewhere there is a RIGS for the Doncaster/S Yorkshire area. I've never heard of there being any streams in Magnesian or Dolomitic Limestone, although, I think, there is a well/resurgence somewhere, which I believe is the only occurance of a cave related feature on that type of limestone coming anywhere near the water table.

However, that being said, I have a nagging thought that there was a report some years back that water was heard in one of the Maltby caves, not Herne Hill No. 1 - which is open but gated (requires Derbyshire key x 2 to open) but one of the other two, both of which have been landscaped and presumed lost behind the supermarket in question.

 

[richardg]

I've done a bit of research into Magnesian/Dolomitic Caves - somewhere there is a RIGS for the Doncaster/S Yorkshire area. I've never heard of there being any streams in Magnesian or Dolomitic Limestone, although, I think, there is a well/resurgence somewhere, which I believe is the only occurance of a cave related feature on that type of limestone coming anywhere near the water table.

However, that being said, I have a nagging thought that there was a report some years back that water was heard in one of the Maltby caves, not Herne Hill No. 1 - which is open but gated (requires Derbyshire key x 2 to open) but one of the other two, both of which have been landscaped and presumed losft behind the supermarket in question.

Thank you for that information Martin.....

The RIGS. Report took its information from available modern written sources, there is no original feild or other information gathering in that report on the Speleological potential of the region and it's limestone's. Someone had just gone around with a copy of Northern Caves guidebook  and that was that.

There are many large resurgences along the edge of the limestone...

Some magnificent phreatic caves are know such as those at Cesswell Crags..... an indication of the scale of cave formation awaiting whoever might do the investigative research and focused effort required

There's at least eight stream sinks that I know of on the limestone near Doncaster, including one very large one......Where tree trunks have been observed to be sucked down.

There is a reasonable height difference and distance between the biggest of the sinks and potential resergences

There is both relic vadose as well as phreatic features to observed in the known caves.....

The flowstone formations, curtains and stalactites, found in some of our Dolomite limestone caves are quite often among some of the most spectacular and beautiful.

It would be exciting to discover and explore an active stream cave, with these indicators of what may be found along the way.......

Richard.

 

[pwhole]

When I visited Creswell for the first time recently, I was very surprised to see the extent of phreatic/vadose development of the side-caves, and could only form the conclusion that the whole area was a large cave system subsequently unroofed and drained relatively quickly, and that the remnants in the sides of the crags were feeder passages, bringing in streams.

 

[RobinGriffiths]

I was on an Open University course about 2 decades ago to a sand quarry somewhere near Durham. And the unconsolidated sand was overlain by the Magnesian Limestone. Now I'm not sure how thick the magnesian limestone is, and whether it always regionally sits on top of the sand, but if that's the case, having a very permeable and porous base must have some control on how water flows in the limestone -presumably limiting horizontal development, and thus active streamways.

Robin

 

[RobinGriffiths]

Seems not. Seems the 'yellow sands' are local to Durham.

 

[C.Raven]

Hello Richard PM sent.

 

[richardg]

Thank you C.Raven your PM is very interesting....

Richard.

 

[mikem]

These might come in useful (the map on page 5 shows all the main rivers crossing the band, although nothing flows to the sea on the surface between Hartlepool & Sunderland):
http://nora.nerc.ac.uk/8147/1/OR09030.pdf
http://nora.nerc.ac.uk/6955/1/IR05048.pdf

Included in the bibliography is:
GIBSON, R, BLISS, M, and SHACKLETON, R. 1976. Caves of the Magnesian Limestone. Yorkshire Subterranean Society Journal, Vol. 1, 9-22.

I haven't found any significant cave development on the cliffs on the lower Wharfe, although there are solution features. The Yorkshire Limestone climbing guide does say something along the line of "Fortunately the cliffs at Wetherby have been found to be a form of sandstone..."

Mike

 

[mikem]

Page 107 of this report suggests most of them are fissure rather than river caves:
http://www.ubss.org.uk/resources/proceedings/vol25/UBSS_Proc_25_1_105-112.pdf

The bibliography also lists - 1979. More caves of the Magnesian Limestone. Yorkshire Subterranean Society Journal, Vol. 2, 50-51 - although it gives the author as A.Speight.

Useful info on here (South Yorkshire):
http://ukcaving.com/wiki/index.php/Yorkshire
http://www.cerberusspeleo.org.uk/conservation/magnes.htm

& some caves between Hartlepool & Sunderland (but are they formed by the sea or the beck?):
http://www.limestonelandscapes.info/media/12354/Cliffs-Caves-and-Curious-Rocks-A3/pdf/CliffsCavesCurious_RocksA3.pdf

Mike

 

[richardg]

Mike... You've obviously done a lot of research into subject. And investigated potential sites.
Informative  sources of previous study you be high lighted thank you.