Andy Farrant said:
For the sake of repeating myself, Drws Cefn was dug open when the land was owned by the Coal Authority, back in the late 1990's. It was much later that it was connected to Ogof Draenen. This important distinction was not clear in the recent Descent article.
Personally I don't think Drws Cefn is the right place for a legal challenge, as we risk jeopardizing access to one of our longest and best caves if the judgement goes against us. There are plenty of other sites on access land where the legal status could be challenged. This whole sorry saga appears to me to be far more about individual egos than the best interests of cavers.
Eighteen months after I dug open the way into the 1984 extensions in Daren Cilau, having heard that the Duke of Beaufort had requested copies of surveys of the new finds, I had a telephone conversation with his land agent, M.J. Dawson, about the new discoveries and followed this up with a letter dated 15th April 1986, which M.J.D. replied to on 18th April.
My parting shot was: "I might add that my interest is spurred from a feeling of personal concern and responsibility that having discovered something of such great interest and value that its future use should be open to as many people as possible, whilst leaving the essence of its character intact."
This we have achieved with Daren Cilau through retaining the difficult nature of the most convenient entrance passage to the further reaches of the system, not involving a long technically-demanding cave dive.
The point here is that you can dig caves anywhere where limestone abounds, but a landowner may have certain paths he wishes visitors to keep to and features, buildings, crops or archaeological remains that he wishes to protect by keeping visitors at a safe distance. He may also develop an interest in creating a show cave accessed via his land. Those who don't actually own the land can only discover the existence of such factors through
consultation and dialogue with the landowner.
So, did those who dug open Drws Cefn from the surface (there was no cave there at all at first) subsequently discuss their find with the landowner (Coal Authority, or otherwise), to regularise and confirm the acceptability of what they had done on private land, without permission? Even the CRoW Act does not automatically authorise cave digging on open-access land without the agreement of the landowner. So, what was the response of the landowner in the case of Drws Cefn? Did the landowner make any stipulations - which only the landowner can remove, if he so wishes?
The point being made in a posting above about those supporting CRoW access to caves needing to support this specific legal action in respect of Drws Cefn/Ogof Draenen is utterly spurious and, if not naively proposed, politically motivated.
There is a long-established cave management body for Ogof Draenen which has the full support of the landowner and also a good many cavers. This is no different than the situation with the cave management of Ogof Ffynnon Ddu and I don't think there is any reasonably-minded person who would go around and start proposing a legal action in respect of 'open access' to OFD.
No, this is simply and plainly an unbridled attempt to unsettle the current Ogof Draenen Cave Management Group and so if you're in the 'club' that seeks to do these sort of things (for whatever reason that escapes me) and would like to replace the existing group with a different management group, comprised of different 'selected' people (whoever these might be), then wade in and give your support - at least be honest and open, rather than secretively deceitful, about what you are attempting to do.
However, if you support the OFD cave management structure then what justification is there for being hypocritical and unsettling the current Ogof Draenen cave management arrangements?
Actually, come to think of it, there were one or two people around trying to unsettle things in BCRA when the access to Ogof Draenen was first being arranged with the Coal Authority and support was sought - so I've been quite aware that, in relation to people who like to be in control of affairs behind the scenes, there has been an 'undertow' operating in respect of Ogof Draenen for a long time.
Respecting the fact that some caves need to be managed (and Ogof Draenen has been managed for a good many years with notable success), not only for keeping out those that would harm themselves or the cave, but for the proper management and servicing of technical fixed aids inside the cave and the coordination of scientific studies within the system, apart from taking decisions to help conserve the cave system for future generations of cavers,
is not incompatible with seeking to have the CRoW Act clarified such that automatic access to non-managed, open-access caves - naturally existing or dug open with the landowner's permission (current or retrospective) - is guaranteed.