Map references

[Cave_Troll]

Looking around various websites and surveys it seems that many people think that a grid reference consists of the letters "NGR" followed by a load of numbers. assuming that the numbers are the correct Eastings and Northing, "NGR" means very little. What should be in front of the numbers is the two letter code telling which 100km square you are refering to.
Thus the survey of Hangover Hole in Stoney Mid says
"NGR 2065 7593" but should be "SK 2065 7593"
(see http://www.multimap.com/map/browse.cgi?lat=53.2797&lon=-1.6925&scale=25000&icon=x)

for more information on how to give a grid reference, see
http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/oswebsite/freefun/nationalgrid/nationalgrid.pdf

 

[Rhys]

Troll

Although I agree with your comment, considering that many of the people putting stuff up on the web or posting on this forum can't handle even basic spelling and grammar, do you think there's much chance of them getting grid references right?

Rhys

 

[mudmonkey]

How likely are you to think "hmmmmm, Hangover Hole, Stoney Middleton, 2065 7593? Which 2065 7593 is that? The one 100km west of all the other caves in Stoney? I think I'll go there"

If the answer is "quite likely", pick a different sport....

I guess in very, very big caving regions (is there any region greater than 100km across in the UK?) it could become an issue but seems a touch pedantic for the Peak....

Not that Mr Troll could ever be accused of pedantry

 

[Cave_Troll]

Mud, indeed. but when i tried to look up where Otter Hole so that i could plan a route down there, i kept coming across "NGR" references.
now i know its down in the south west somewhere, but i had several 100km grid squares to pick from.

 

[Rhys]

Mud, indeed. but when i tried to look up where Otter Hole so that i could plan a route down there, i kept coming across "NGR" references.
now i know its down in the south west somewhere, but i had several 100km grid squares to pick from.

It's not in the South West. It's in the South East (of Wales).

I hear that the weather scuppered your trip. Better luck next time. I only go there when there's a chance of a national TV appearance (like last time).

Rhys

 

[Cave_Troll]

even if you do get labelled wrongly

 

[kay]

How likely are you to think "hmmmmm, Hangover Hole, Stoney Middleton, 2065 7593? Which 2065 7593 is that? The one 100km west of all the other caves in Stoney? I think I'll go there"

If the answer is "quite likely", pick a different sport....

If, like me, you're a horizontal caver in the Dales, and therefore spend your days trying to distinguish the insignificant hole that is your cave from all the other insignificant holes which are merely large rabbit holes, then grid refs are very useful.

But you're right - being as petrified of trivial hieghts as I am 'Get another sport' is sensible advice.

Just that life is less fun if you always obey sensible advice.

 

[mudman]

Mud, indeed. but when i tried to look up where Otter Hole so that i could plan a route down there, i kept coming across "NGR" references.
now i know its down in the south west somewhere, but i had several 100km grid squares to pick from.

It's not in the South West. It's in the South East (of Wales).

I hear that the weather scuppered your trip. Better luck next time. I only go there when there's a chance of a national TV appearance (like last time).

Rhys

Could have been the one in Assynt,
NGR: NC 26803 17061

 

[Cave_Troll]

i think there's another one somewhere near Matlock as well

 

[mudman]

Is that Otter Holes in the Morcambe Bay area?
There's also Lower Otter Hole which is just down the hill a bit from the Scottish Otter Hole.

Otter Hole Caves

 

[BCMCXIV]

Whilst we're on the subject of map references, the one quoted for Knock Fell Caverns in NC3 is bollocks, as two hours wondering around in the pissing rain a couple of years back will testify to. It is on the opposite side of the track to the shakehole indicated by the NC3 reference.

 

[dunc]

I agree that proper grid refs should be given, it seems that NGR is used to signify that the random jumble of numbers following it are in fact something meaningful.
I think the general assumption amongst people is that as long as an area (the more specific the area the better) is given the chance of a grid ref repeating is so low that the letters are not required, I would guess in some situations that is true but not all..

It is on the opposite side of the track to the shakehole indicated by the NC3 reference.

The grid ref is a bit out yes, but It does say in the description of Knock that it is 50m west of the Pennine Way...

 

[paul]

i think there's another one somewhere near Matlock as well

Otter Hole Resurgence SK 046733

Its near Buxton

 

[Cave_Troll]

i thought i might be, just didn't want to offend the cave by associating it with buxton.

Still thats quite a good trip. entrance in South East Wales, Resurgance near Buxton.

 

[AndyF]

Hi cave_troll

Have you been down Hangover Hole...?

 

[Cave_Troll]

Ummm no

 

[BCMCXIV]

The grid ref is a bit out yes, but It does say in the description of Knock that it is 50m west of the Pennine Way...

That is assuming that I know how to read a compass... which I obviously didn't on that day. :shock:

Though what probably happened was that it didn't click with me that the map reference and the description wouldn't match, so I assumed that west meant east.

 

[BCMCXIV]

The grid ref is a bit out yes, but It does say in the description of Knock that it is 50m west of the Pennine Way...

That is assuming that I know how to read a compass... which I obviously didn't on that day. :shock:

Though what probably happened was that it didn't click with me that the map reference and the description wouldn't match, so I assumed that west meant east.