Site Sale

[Roger W]

Mind you, Kay, you are one of those with a website link in your signature... 

 

[Peter Burgess]

How many times a year do you sign up to a bulletin board? That many times that answering one email per site is such a fag?

It's not that it's a fag, it just feels unfriendly. "We don't really want you here so you've got to convince us that you're worth having as a member". That's how it has felt to me on the receiving end with other sites. OK, I am unduly sensitive, but are we saying that we don't want sensitive types on ukcaving?

The invitation email would make it perfectly clear that the application was very welcome. Most clubs have a means to vet new members far more intimidating that what I am proposing and that doesn't stop them growing. WCMS has had such a scheme for several years and our membership is at a record high this year.

Anybody not really interested in caving won't bother replying, or even trying to join in the first place if they are going to have to identify themselves and give a VERY BRIEF explanation of their reasons. Any site than wants an in depth 250 word justification won't survive and doesn't exist anyway. The one site I joined that wanted me to say why I was joining was happy merely for me to say I was interested in something the site was discussing.

Examples of brief reasons:

I am a caver and I need to ask xyz - (pretty obvious)
I own a cave - (likewise)
I want to take up caving
I know lots about caves and want to answer a question I have spotted.
I am a friend of Cap'n Chris (borderline)
I want to meet other cavers now I have moved to Somerset

Anybody who can't be bothered to answer with even this brief an explanation will probably find posting (or reading) anything longer a bit of a chore.

 

[bubba]

How long do you think it will take the spammers to work out what to put in order to get accepted? Just because they're spammers doesn't mean they're stupid.

It's easier just to have an occasional purge.

 

[Peter Burgess]

I co-moderate a board with roughly the same number of applications per year (about 100 a year). That site doesn't get this problem. I would say the unwanted members just don't bother. The process I described is more or less the one we use. Works a treat.

So like I said, it's just a suggestion to make life easier for you guys. It makes no difference at all to me whether UKCaving takes it on or not.

 

[bubba]

Running an occasional database query is easier than having to check registration emails every day.

100 a year? Quite a few more than that.

Anyway, not really my decision any more.

 

[Peter Burgess]

Since 2003 the following numbers of members were registered each year:

2003 - 26
2004 - 47
2005 - 58
2006 - 100
2007 - 107
2008 - 96
2009 - 115

About 100 per year genuine new members - anyone else wouldn't bother. But like you say it's an SEP.

 

[bubba]

But you'd have to check every registration email anyway to see what they'd written in the "why I want to join" field.

If people can be bothered to sign up, put their website in their profile and (often) make a realistic-looking post somewhere in the forums then putting a quick sentence in a "why I want to join" isn't going to put them off imo, especially when they're getting paid to do it.

 

[whitelackington]

Just out of interest, and probably because I was a bit bored, I have been through the membership list looking at joining dates.

Since 2003 the following numbers of members were registered each year:

2003 - 26
2004 - 47
2005 - 58
2006 - 100
2007 - 107
2008 - 96
2009 - 115
2010 to present - 1701.

Yes, that's 1701.

So I looked at those members and the vast majority of them have posted nothing. Most of the ones I checked have links to websites in their signatures. Surprise surprise.

Why I added this to this particular thread is I was wondering if this plethora of spammers (or whatever name these people have) has signed up since the change of ownership, and wonder if it is just a coincidence, or whether a memberlist pruning process isn't running any more. Has the joining process been changed, and if only a dozen of so genuine people are joining each month whether new applications should be given a check over before membership is accepted.

For example, each new member should be asked to provide by email a brief reason why they want to join, and anyone signing up with a blatant marketing non-caver related signature is immediately deleted.

Just a thought.

It seems bizare that more than ten times the number of people have joined in the last twelve months than in previous years, especially as there are much less postings than there once were.

 

[paul]

So I looked at those members and the vast majority of them have posted nothing. Most of the ones I checked have links to websites in their signatures. Surprise surprise.

Why I added this to this particular thread is I was wondering if this plethora of spammers (or whatever name these people have) has signed up since the change of ownership, and wonder if it is just a coincidence, or whether a memberlist pruning process isn't running any more. Has the joining process been changed, and if only a dozen of so genuine people are joining each month whether new applications should be given a check over before membership is accepted.

For example, each new member should be asked to provide by email a brief reason why they want to join, and anyone signing up with a blatant marketing non-caver related signature is immediately deleted.

Judging by the behaviour of avatars, signatures and messages, although messages do not change with time, the avatar and signature are tied to the User's current Profile. So having passed all the tests to register, they only would have to post a few messages then change their signature to whatever they wish....

 

[Peter Burgess]

Like the car thief - why bother breaking into a car when he can find one that isn't locked? Most of these people have lazy-itis.

If you CBA to try the suggestion, say so, rather than poo poo the idea... 

 

[Stu]

Examples of brief reasons:

I am a caver and I need to ask xyz - (pretty obvious)
I own a cave - (likewise)
I want to take up caving
I know lots about caves and want to answer a question I have spotted.
I am a friend of Cap'n Chris (borderline)
I want to meet other cavers now I have moved to Somerset

Anybody who can't be bothered to answer with even this brief an explanation will probably find posting (or reading) anything longer a bit of a chore.

Serious question: if someone gives an answer that you somehow don't think fits I assume you bar them. Is there an appeal?

 

[Peter Burgess]

On the site I mentioned, this very rarely happens. If there has ever been any doubt, a brief second email has always clarified things. Nobody has ever been barred. The primary purpose of the process is to deter idiots who have no genuine interest in the site. I guess every site has administrators with different ideas and attitudes so all I can do is mention what I have seen done elsewhere.

 

[speleotel]

Dear Shark and Toby.

I am replying on a different tack to the thread at the moment. Firstly congratulations to both of you for taking on a couple of Forums that provide valuable information to outdoor activists for Bouldering and Caving. In my opinion the forum has been invaluable; to provide the community/ies with current whats on , whats happening etc.

I know several of the posters/avatars by their role, experience and knowledge within the caving field even if they do not know me and although I am not a regular forum poster I do use the site almost daily to keep abreast of whats happening in the caving community. I imagine the Bouldering Community is as intimate and tightknit as the caving crowd.  The site has served an essential communication role for the community for the period that I have known of it.

The UK Caving Forum gives a voice regarding technological breakthroughs, caving and potholing successes (and disasters) and immediate news on access issues and it is also happy to welcome new Forum Users asking questions as to who to contact and where to go as they enter for the first time into the activity.  The  moderation means I have not noticed, generally, too much abuse in the site, which I think means they are doing their job well even though there is digression and occasional lapses into slanging matches but no more than we witness in the early hours of weekends at the hut or at conferences.

So, welcome to hosting the Caving mob, it is off the wall some of the time but you are hosting a very useful service.