The Woggle Press(ident)

[Hatstand]

Evenin' All

Whilst pondering the recent Swildons movements etc I was reminded of the Woggle Press in EastWHERE?? not least because it was likely to see more traffic for a while.

Can anyone recount the story of what happened, and more to the point, I am curious as to what the implications were for access to the cave/remedial work etc. I thought it would be interesting to compare.

 

[mrodoc]

Although before my time from what I know the old route to the Boulder Chamber moved in the early 60's when a party of scouts were in the cave and one was crushed by a boulder hence the name. It was after this the guide line was laid through the ruckle. The ruckle has moved once since then near the entrance causing a major collapse in the late 60's sealing the cave for a while and leading to work on a shaft into boulder chamber (remains of the work above and left of current entrance can be still seen I think). However a route into the ruckle was reengineered and has appeared to be stable since. Cavers started to use the Woggle Press route probably in the '80's and it has been increasingly used on the basis of 'it ain't moved yet'.  However I have always been very nervous going through there and the ruckle is nowhere near stable. On one occasion about 20 years ago I was only slightly off route coming out when a minor collapse occurred below me - frightening as I wasn't sure which way to move and even more so when you consider i was only 3 metres off the guide rope.

the current wet conditions lead me to suggest that cavers should have considerable respect for the Eastwater ruckle. the fact that there hasn't been a major collapse for 30 years is neither here nor there - it's no time at all geologically and, unlike Swildons entrance area the ruckle is vast so human intervention is not really viable. Sooner or later the ruckle is going to move again. Perhaps we should revisit the concept of a mined shaft into a more stable area of the cave. Exploration in the '80's revealed a number of ascending avens that might be potentially viable as entrances.

 

[exsumper]

Interesting to compare yes, but opening a can of worms, that the lid is best left on.

 

[tony from suffolk]

Your recollection is correct mrodoc, but I would add that the Eastwater ruckle has moved several times over the years since the cave was reopened - I witnessed a friend being nearly crushed by a boulder close to the entrance - the event was so traumatic he never went caving again unfortunately.

I used to go down Eastwater a lot before the entrance collapsed & my heart was always in my mouth climbing down the entrance;fortunately the chaps who reopened the cave did a superb job on this bit but IMO there are still areas of the ruckle which on examination appear very loose, particularly as you approach the 380' Way.

The plan to drop a shaft directly to the Boulder Chamber would have completely bypassed the ruckle, and at the time I wrote a letter to Descent expressing my concerns when this was abandoned in favour of re-opening the original entrance. There may well have been very good practical reasons for this course of action but I never learned what these were.

Regarding the "Woggle Press", I've always avoided this and used the Traverse to access the rest of the cave. This may be unnecessary but we always understood this area was the most unstable of all and best avoided.

 

[mrodoc]

Well, that's two of us who regard the ruckle with the greatest of respect.  I can quite understand why your friend was so shaken up. The rumble below me the time it shifted under me was heart stopping. My wife used to cave regularly but never liked Eastwater. Perhaps we could start a 'New entrance for Eastwater?' thread

 

[Clive G]

Although before my time from what I know the old route to the Boulder Chamber moved in the early 60's when a party of scouts wereas in the cave and one* was crushed by a boulder hence the name . . .

* A climber, aged 24, from Westbury-on-Trym, caving with 3 others. He was a member of the Bristol College of Technology Caving Club.
http://ukcaving.com/board/index.php/topic,9102.msg121820.html#msg121820

 

[exsumper]

If people are worried about the safety of the Eastwater boulder ruckle, And I agree the woggle press is a possible route if your willing to take the risk.
Tony the naturist is right,  I offer a slightly amusing tale. In the late nineties I climbed up to the roof of the boulder chamber, which was a bit of a dodgy climb because it was up a 5mtr wide area of shattered rock that streches from the floor to the roof of the chamber, this is associated with a fault that is near the eastern boundary of the cave. It was a case of if you dont like a hold pull it off and select another one. I arrived at the ledge and as there were no natural anchors I chose to sacrifice a large hex to use as an anchor to abseil back down. Unbeknown to me, Mark lumley, (Gonzo)had spent the last few weeks digging an updip phreatic passage from kentish cairn. He thought he had achieved a breakthrough and was most excited to see black space ahead of him. Until he thrutched through looked along the ledge and saw the rope sling attached to my Hex. Bastard I think his opinion was. The upshot was that there was a large phreatic tube heading off of this ledge and Gonzo, Tav, Jake, and myself dug this for a week or two until we came across a vertical passage that suddenly slumped in almost entombing us diggers and swallowing one of the fence posts around the Eastwater depression.

If an alternative entrance is ever needed this is the ideal site.

 

[Maggot]

Swildons entrance never worried me too much, but Eastwater's entrance gives me the fear.

 

[mrodoc]

Rich West asked me to post this:

?Eastwater Cavern, Saturday 30th July 1960

A party of 4 students from the Bristol Technical College went down the cave and on the way out from the Boulder Chamber, A.H., who was leading across the head of the 380 Foot Way, triggered off a loose rock and brought the roof down (about 240 cu.ft. of it). He was crushed by the rocks, which rolled off him, not pinning him. At 8.50 p.m. the alarm was given. Luke Devenish took charge of the operation, with Dr. Stanley Cannicott. A.H. was found to have a crushed chest, a broken back and contusion of the lungs. He was placed face downwards in the carrying sheet, which prevented the spinal injury from being made worse. By 11.20 p.m. he was out of the cave and was sent by ambulance to the Bristol Royal Infirmary, where in spite of the most energetic treatment he died at 5.40 a.m. the next morning.?

This is the offical MRO report of the incident.

 

[Hatstand]

Thanks Mrodoc - most enlightening 

 

[Clive G]

Rich West asked me to post this:

?Eastwater Cavern, Saturday 30th July 1960

A party of 4 students from the Bristol Technical College . . . A.H., who was leading across the head of the 380 Foot Way, triggered off a loose rock and brought the roof down (about 240 cu.ft. of it). He was crushed by the rocks, which rolled off him, not pinning him . . .?

This is the offical MRO report of the incident.

The report that I came across was dated Thursday. Aug. 1. 1960., which looked as if it was a misprint for 11 (rather than 4), so, since the report referred to the death as having taken place on the Saturday night, it appeared as if the accident had happened in early August rather than late July.

However, it was the Bristol College of Technology Caving Club - apparently the forerunner of the University of Bath!  http://www.bath.ac.uk/internal/staff/intro/history.html

There is also a slightly different slant on the incident itself:

"On the way back to the surface he was climbing a passage known as 'The 380 ft Way' when part of the rock gave way.

He fell with the boulder & received internal injuries. Two of the party stayed with him while the other went for help.

Rescuers formed a chain to haul him 300 ft to the surface. The rescue took 2 hours."

The casualty's companions were uninjured.

 

[graham]

Rich West asked me to post this:

Can the admin not sort Mr West out with a working log in, please?

 

[mrodoc]

Yes, Rich is having problems logging in. The report is probably the most definitive about the incident as this was the official MRO incident report. Obviously names of colleges might be slightly wrong but I would have thought the details of the incident and rescue would be be pretty accurate.

 

[Hatstand]

were there any repercussions?

 

[Clive G]

. . . I would have thought the details of the incident and rescue would be be pretty accurate.

In this thread I was only originally trying to dispel the idea that scouts had been the key protagonists, but the deeper one probes the more that seems to pop up to the surface!

The Rich West report, which you've kindly posted on his behalf, states "A.H. . . . triggered off a loose rock and brought the roof down (about 240 cu.ft. of it). He was crushed by the rocks, which rolled off him, not pinning him . . ." This not only sounds a lot more dramatic, but also apportions blame. It does make you wonder, though, how the casualty managed not to be pinned in amongst the 240 cu. ft of rock which is supposed to have moved, why none of the three companions were injured and also how one of them managed to make a fairly rapid exit to call for help?

The alternative report, however, merely states, as a matter of fact, that "part of the rock gave way." So, I guess it is the perspective from which the individuals who wrote the reports approached the subject from that has mattered most and has determined the angle taken?

 

[mrodoc]

Eyewitnesses are needed and these may be hard to come by. Luke Devenish died some years ago and I don't think Dr. Cannicott is with us anymore. However there may be younger individuals who were caving with MRO at that time but probably not on UK caving forum. Brian Prewer comes to mind as being an active caver and in MRO at that time. The line was laid by MRO, at least that's what I have always understood. Perhaps Mr. West when he is able to log in can add more detail.

 

[graham]

The line was, I think, laid by MRO. Maybe Jim Hanwell might have some details.

Lloyd used to tell a marvellous Eastwater story: it seems that at one point the advisory route through the boulders had been marked out in red paint. Lloyd described a trip where one guy on his first trip down this cave turned back, for whatever reason I don't recall. When the rest of the party were exiting they found him still in the choke, where he had encountered great difficult avoiding all the dangerous boulders "the ones marked in red"!

 

[Elaine]

If it was nothing to do with a scout leader, then why is is called the woggle press? I always thought it was a great name (even if tasteless).

"Who was Aveline anyway?" says it was a boy scout in 1960. Presumably AH was something to do with scouts.

 

[tony from suffolk]

The first time I went down Eastwater was sometime in 1962, probably Easter hols,  (in the company of a certain Pete Bird from UBSS) and even then, so soon after the tragic event, we were told various horrific stories about a scout who was trapped in the boulders "...and they could hear his screams but no one could get to him!!" No doubt specifically designed to scare the willies out of us young schoolboys! These stories merely succeeded in increasing our desire to go down Eastwater, the thrill of danger further enhanced by the large warning sign at the entrance proclaiming "Dangerous Cave!!"

The white guideline through the ruckle lasted for a while and we always followed it precisely, even though it went a bit round the houses in a couple of places. Then when it started to disintegrate we had a couple of panicky trips before we worked out the route.

I confess I'd never heard the name "Woggle Press" until very recently on this Forum. It's certainly a relatively recent title, although I've a fair idea where it is.

 

[egons pete]

Regarding the collapse of the entrance ruckle I was one of the party that reopened the cave in the late sixties and was there when we made the final breakthough the boulders were stabilized with some aggregate (liberated from the then SCC roadworks nr the junction of the priddy, bristol to Wells road) I cant remember where the cement was perloined from! However it was never a cave that I liked and I still did'nt quite trust the new way in so only ever went down there once more. There was an all night piss up held to celibrate the event mainly at the long defunct nordrach country club, after a session in the Grunters of course.