Author Topic: Early mining ore extraction techniques.  (Read 608 times)

Online Tomferry

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Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« on: October 06, 2021, 09:59:01 am »
I have been reading some of my coal mining books for early mining methods and came across a page containing this image I shall attach a link below as I can’t insert the image myself .

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=coal+mining+ladies+carrying+baskets&tbm=isch&ved=2ahUKEwjA1s7ysrXzAhWO_IUKHUQvDwUQ2-cCegQIABAC&oq=coal+mining+ladies+carrying+baskets&gs_lcp=ChJtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1pbWcQAzoECB4QCjoCCCk6BAghEAo6BAgAEA06BQgAEIAEOgYIABAFEB46BggAEAgQHjoECAAQGFDeF1jeU2CwWWgAcAB4AIABkgGIAc8akgEFMjYuMTCYAQCgAQHAAQE&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-img&ei=X2JdYYCrNo75lwTE3rwo&bih=715&biw=414&client=safari&prmd=sivxn#imgrc=XfJnFzitRC5HZM

In the book it says : in the early days of coal mining many ways where devised to get the coal from the depths of the earth .this method was used in Scotland and it consisted of a circular wooden staircase , as far as we no the idea was never used in Wales . We should remember that we are only dealing with children in wales , similar conditions existed in other coal fields in Britain .

The book is about child Labour in mines . I have also read about this is other coal mining books , they said it was woman who did this job typically , the children would drag the corves out from the working face and empty them into hazel or willow baskets to be carried out “like the image “ or by windlass or stair case , in other images it shows a similar image in situ in a bell pit

Does anyone else have any knowledge or proof of this technique being used ?

Online mikem

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2021, 11:31:11 am »
Image is also used in this article about child labour & says it was from 1844:
https://spartacus-educational.com/spartacus-blogURL97.htm

Offline Roger the Cat

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #2 on: October 06, 2021, 11:41:51 am »
It sounds a far too elegant a solution for primitive mining and would require substantial time and effort to construct to any depth. The only shafts I can think of with such attributes would be the Grand Shaft at Western Heights, Dover and various ancient wells on the Indian sub-continent, much featured in National Geographic magazines over the years. At what point did deep coal mining (definition required) begin? Sixteenth century? If my memory serves me correctly it was a tradition to pick up coal from Northumberland beaches in living memory, if not now and I expect the same was true for any coal outcrop.

Online Tomferry

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #3 on: October 06, 2021, 11:51:13 am »
http://www.scottishmining.co.uk/164.html


Their is a mention of it in their again  also with some dates  :-\

Offline ttxela2

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2021, 11:51:19 am »
I wonder if someone has had a climbing shaft with stemples described to them without actually seeing one and come up with this as their perception of what was described.


Online Cantclimbtom

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #5 on: October 06, 2021, 02:48:28 pm »
Failing to find any reference to this apart from in Scotland where they are called a turnpike stair, although I think that might just be Scots for what a Sassenach like me would call a "spiral staircase" rather than being mine specific. Maybe for shallow shafts prior to engines it could be used, but can't see it as practical for much depth?

"...Windmills were also tried but were too irregular. An early method of working was a circular shaft, with a turnpike stair, up which in the days of slavery, the coal was carried in baskets on the backs of women, the coal bearers of that period. By the introduction of the steam-engine, water, coal, and other material can now be raised from great depths..." "Historic Notices and Domestic History of the Parish of Shotts", by William Grossart, surgeon, 1880
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Online Tomferry

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2021, 03:10:29 pm »
I shall have to dig my other books out that mention this ,I have to admit
I believe all the images are the exact same one , then again though so are all the ones of children working in coal mines I believe these are the same images as the iron industry as well  maybe these sketches are the only evidence left ?

Online mikem

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #7 on: October 06, 2021, 05:04:41 pm »
Picture is from an 1842 report referring to east of Scotland mines, which aren't that deep:
https://www.hoodfamily.info/coal/stairpits.html

The report, with relevant part highlighted (including several images; & yes it is a Scottish name for any spiral stairs):
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=mfRSh-ctOR4C&pg=PA9&lpg=PA9&dq=turnpike+stairs+mining&source=bl&ots=dOU-GHvwxI&sig=ACfU3U1U9FeLAOhFiLZRegbrfm6zRD4nlQ&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjqnd_mk7bzAhVIgVwKHSWhCAQQ6AF6BAg7EAI#v=onepage&q=turnpike%20stairs%20mining&f=false
« Last Edit: October 06, 2021, 05:17:22 pm by mikem »

Online ChrisJC

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #8 on: October 06, 2021, 06:23:20 pm »
I am not convinced they ever existed. What a lot of effort to build them when ladders (which can be made outside and brought in) and platforms / stemples can be used instead.

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Online Tomferry

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #9 on: October 06, 2021, 06:38:53 pm »
I knew you wouldn’t believe it !  :ras:

Where is Roy he will no the truth ?

Online Cantclimbtom

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #10 on: October 06, 2021, 09:06:25 pm »
Bloomin 'eck Tom, I know Roy is senior to many of us, but are you suggesting he can remember back to the 1840s? He's not that old!
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Offline AR

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #11 on: October 06, 2021, 09:08:06 pm »
If my memory serves me correctly it was a tradition to pick up coal from Northumberland beaches in living memory, if not now and I expect the same was true for any coal outcrop.
That's sea-coaling you're thinking of - the coastal collieries dumped their waste into the sea, and the residual coal was effectively buddled out by wave action to be collected by anyone willing to put the effort in.
Dirty old mines need love too....

Offline pwhole

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #12 on: October 06, 2021, 10:03:23 pm »
The last five minutes of Get Carter shows a pretty classy setup in that regard at Blackhall Colliery Beach:

https://www.getcarter.xyz/locations/blackhall-colliery-beach/

Online SamT

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #13 on: October 06, 2021, 10:33:55 pm »
I am not convinced they ever existed. What a lot of effort to build them when ladders (which can be made outside and brought in) and platforms / stemples can be used instead.

Chris.

There's a short one in Raddlepits made out of dry stone ginging.  I know as Ive walked up it.   I reckon there must have been times when miners were at a bit of a loose end, waiting around for stuff, empty kibbles to be returned from surface etc. or work was slack for some reason and maybe one day, dreamt big to alleviate the boredom.

Online mikem

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #14 on: October 07, 2021, 12:30:21 am »
To start with mining was very localised & they used the skills that were available from other applications - spiral stairs were very popular in castles, which there are plenty of in Scotland (& elsewhere). It was only later that mines got so deep that everyone had to invite the Cornish in...

Online Tomferry

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #15 on: October 07, 2021, 08:11:59 am »
Bloomin 'eck Tom, I know Roy is senior to many of us, but are you suggesting he can remember back to the 1840s? He's not that old!

He knows a vast amount of knowledge about old technology that’s what I meant  :ras:

Online Tomferry

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #16 on: October 07, 2021, 08:14:56 am »
To start with mining was very localised & they used the skills that were available from other applications - spiral stairs were very popular in castles, which there are plenty of in Scotland (& elsewhere). It was only later that mines got so deep that everyone had to invite the Cornish in...

Agreed it’s quite a complicated subject as  it seems to change where ever you look , I have only read about the East Midlands coal field and the south darbyshire coal field and these are very different techniques in their early days , in the East Midlands it was still done completely by hand until 1901 when they finally was happy with a cutting machine to bring into the first colliery.  It appears to change technique to suit the coal seam they was mining  in the earlier days

Offline moorebooks

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #17 on: October 07, 2021, 09:57:50 am »
 the only staircase I have seen is at Wieliczka Salt Mine in Poland,

there were reported to be wooden stairs in the Bradha Head Mine Isle of man


Mike

Online Tomferry

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Re: Early mining ore extraction techniques.
« Reply #18 on: October 07, 2021, 10:16:30 am »
the only staircase I have seen is at Wieliczka Salt Mine in Poland,

there were reported to be wooden stairs in the Bradha Head Mine Isle of man


Mike

https://flickr.com/photos/193182234@N06/51379970108/in/album-72157719683556944/

I believe you mean this 1 it’s a long bloody way down I couldn’t believe it !


 

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