Author Topic: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced  (Read 2637 times)

Offline aricooperdavis

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2020, 09:59:27 am »
Yes, but farmers generally aren't very keen on that sort of thing...

They don't have to actually verify the code if they trust that the certificate itself hasn't been faked. And faking a liability insurance certificate would probably invalidate any liability claim you made against a landowner anyway...

Offline 2xw

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #26 on: November 28, 2020, 10:02:29 am »
Is a plastic card (and I dunno about you but mine had spelling mistakes) intrinsically less trustworthy than a piece of paper

Offline aricooperdavis

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #27 on: November 28, 2020, 10:05:47 am »
Is a plastic card (and I dunno about you but mine had spelling mistakes) intrinsically less trustworthy than a piece of paper

I guess most people have a printer but don't have an ID card printer, so there's a small "you'd have to order it online for very cheap" obstacle to overcome for faking a BCA card.

Offline Pitlamp

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #28 on: November 28, 2020, 10:15:24 am »
The existing card is a lot more weatherproof than a piece of paper. It can live wherever, ready for use if asked for - and it doesn't matter when it gets soaked etc as it'll always be there in a form that doesn't look unconvincing. No forward planning is needed when you go away for the weekend.

Mikem made a very good point; many hill farmers still think in analogue. (Which is actually quite nice, in a way . . . )


Offline mrodoc

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #29 on: November 28, 2020, 10:36:52 am »
This thread shows we don't have a society based on trust. If we did just telling somebody you are covered should be enough. Shame we don't.

Online Ian Ball

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #30 on: November 28, 2020, 11:41:12 am »
Why is BCA membership annual? If i could buy a two year membership that could halve the plastic with little admin effort if the IT infrastructure can deal with it?

Another option is a cheaper renewal price and you keep the same card.  Undated or as previously mentioned, with a expiration date sticker updated an ually.

I appreciate that the BCA card is little real environmental impact compared to other things but removal is an easy thing to do, a quick win that saves cash, seems an easy choice.
 
Having said that, I like my card.

Offline idriswilliams

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #31 on: November 28, 2020, 01:59:21 pm »
Current National Trust cards have a label saying "I am paper not plastic. and can be recycled as paper or added to a compost pile" Not had the opportunity to use it as an ice scraper but it cuts cheese OK.

 

Offline mikem

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #32 on: November 28, 2020, 05:28:26 pm »
I bought a four pack of beer saying no plastic, but the cardboard holder was plasticised!

Online Robert Scott

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #33 on: November 28, 2020, 08:31:09 pm »
Current National Trust cards have a label saying "I am paper not plastic. and can be recycled as paper or added to a compost pile" Not had the opportunity to use it as an ice scraper but it cuts cheese OK.
Sadly in the back pocket of a pair of jeans, mine didn't really survive in the washing machine. It was still a National Trust card but whose?
« Last Edit: November 28, 2020, 08:43:02 pm by Robert Scott »

Offline Ben W

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #34 on: November 28, 2020, 08:40:54 pm »
Would it be technically achievable to have a membership card that doesn't get replaced every year? You'd have to verify online whether it's expired or not, but I'd rather have a swanky card than a pdf.

Offline Oceanrower

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #35 on: November 28, 2020, 09:06:21 pm »
In, what, 12 years of being a member, I have not yet found a use for mine.

Surely it could be available for only those that request it!

Online Robert Scott

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #36 on: November 28, 2020, 09:19:17 pm »
With regard to club members, whether cavers or non-cavers, joining BCA directly and this being the only route rather than through their club then I wonder about its impact on the BCA’s Insurance & Membership FAQ number 34.

Can a selection of club decide not to avail of the insurance membership?
No, if the club wants insurance for club risks (e.g. decisions of officers, club meets, etc) then it must declare all members (caving and non-caving) when selecting their membership category, should that category include insurance as a benefit.

So how will a club be informed that its membership, which could be 250+, has paid the individual insurance so that the officers and committee can be assured that their actions are covered?

How will the BCA chase up those individuals who just haven’t got round to paying up?

Offline PeteHall

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #37 on: November 28, 2020, 09:55:05 pm »
Exactly the same way they do now for members who pay BCA subs through another club.

Offline mikem

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #38 on: November 28, 2020, 10:34:58 pm »
The check may be the same, but currently they have to state they are members of another club, which won't work easily when everyone signs up individually.

Offline 2xw

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #39 on: November 28, 2020, 11:21:23 pm »
Could work like this:

1. When secretary takes club subs, they ask for bca membership number
2. They check it (or plural in bulk) against database

The membership voted for it to happen and the bca is obliged to come up with a solution by next agm

Offline aricooperdavis

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #40 on: November 28, 2020, 11:43:34 pm »
Just to be very clear, clubs will still be able to (and will be encouraged to) administer membership for their members, the change is that these members will be of the same class as those who joined the BCA directly.

Offline Sam Richards

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #41 on: November 29, 2020, 08:36:07 am »
This change wouldn't alter how I process the renewals of my club.
If someone tells me they have BCA membership external to the club then I take their BCA number, and it gets checked. 'External' being different CIM or DIM, it doesn't make a difference.

I could definitely live with or without cards, but that's a different topic that's already ground along for several pages elsewhere.

The £25 flat fee is a nice move.

Offline Ian P

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #42 on: November 29, 2020, 08:42:25 am »
To help cover clubs from the “ legal” / “compliance” side, could they just change their “rules” to state something along the lines of
“To be a valid member of this caving club you must be a member of the BCA”

This covers the officers and puts some responsibility on the individuals.

I have very little understanding of the complex issues involved but I always like a simple solution where possible.  :)

Online Robert Scott

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Re: Joining Fee for Clubs Reduced
« Reply #43 on: November 29, 2020, 01:35:56 pm »
To help cover clubs from the “ legal” / “compliance” side, could they just change their “rules” to state something along the lines of
“To be a valid member of this caving club you must be a member of the BCA”

This covers the officers and puts some responsibility on the individuals.

I have very little understanding of the complex issues involved but I always like a simple solution where possible.  :)
Already does - Rule 5.5 (but without mentioning BCA)

 

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