ILoveCaves
Member
Anyone else having any issue with the AV titan? Feel like the quality of them has decreased over the years?
If you do a lot of very gritty or very gravelly type caving where you spend a lot of time in contact with walls and the like, then the Warmbac oversuits are harder wearing and seem to last reasonably well in these environments. Though you do sacrifice the increased mobility and lighter weight that the AV oversuits provide.gingernutcrazy said:Thanks all! Yeah so far I?ve heard that just newer ones (as in the past 3 years) haven?t been up to scratch? Looking at getting a new one and not sure I will stay with the AV Titan, though as said I?m sure it depends on what you do cave wise
pwhole said:I did give mine the Aquasure treatment on the seams (inside), and it did seem to help - I've only got minor fraying around the waist elastic point. However, I was looking for a shaft in a thorny area a few months ago, and when I got back to get changed, I had about ten neat slits across one butt cheek that I didn't even notice happening....
Shapatti said:gingernutcrazy said:I think as has been suggested in this thread, the issues raised are more to do with the material used instead of the design of the suit, though they've always had slight issues with the hems and seams fraying, especially on the sides at the waist.
One of the best suggestions I have heard was given to me by Tony Seddon at Starless River, his suggestion was to cover all of the seams and hems of a new oversuit with Aquasure (Other adhesives are available)
It doesn't look that pretty but it does seem to extend the life of oversuits with the issue of the seams failing.
Just a few thoughts, which may help with this (or other caving equipment longevity considerations).
Firstly, Aquasure is not an "adhesive" - it's a "repair compound" - this is an important difference. I say this because I've known cavers obtain it for use as a general adhesive and have not found it to be satisfactory in all situations.
For a garment which is priced well into three figures, it's not really good enough that the purchaser should be expected to start the time consuming and messy process of adding a seam strengthening compound, from the word go.
I always thought that choice of material used is part of the design process. Given that this is just the equivalent of a cotton boiler suit (costing a few quid) then, for the asking price, should we expect the manufacturer to take more care over selection of materials?
If the material is going to fail by delamination, leading to waterproof characteristics equivalent to a tea bag, what's the point of sealing seams (other than trying to stop them tearing apart)?
Some of the above sounds quite negative but I realise that specialised caving equipment manufacturers will never be supplying a large volume market (which influences prices) and we should be grateful that we have them at all! So I'm really not trying to bash AV here - I just hope they quickly get on top of what I would like to think of as a temporary problem.
topcat said:Maybe we need to persuade Warmbac to add a design to their range based in the cut of AV and perhaps using the lighter Cordura? No need for double knees or elbows : surely we all use pads?
I'll donate my very clean and good condition, but very disseminated AV for them to cut up for a pattern.......