cooleycr said:
However, and maybe I am oversensitive, but being concerned about animal welfare I would never put any animal through this, what if something happened and one ended up killing or maiming a favourite pet - unforgivable, and what would the cave rescue organisations think about people taking animals (and very young children) caving, seeing as how they spend a fair bit of their time rescuing animals anyway?!?!?!...
I've always felt it is individual dependent just as it is for humans.
"what if??" is never a good excuse. What if your adult friend you took gets hurt? what if you get hurt? What if is a good way to never do anything fun in life.
Animal wealfare...uhm...my dog goes in on her own accord so happy and excited, hells no I'm not taking that from her. What if your dog gets out of the fenced yard and gets hit by a car? What if it chokes on it's favourite treat or bone? I hope you see what I am getting at here. Learn some basic dog language (body language) you'll know if they like or don't like something.
I am a dog trainer, and a handler for k9 SAR as well as in cave rescue sans-doggie. Honestly, the biggest longest hardest rescues I see are adults who have the "it can't happen to me" mentality. And sure there is the odd animal rescue from a cave but usually it is a cow that got through a fence and gets stuck, or sadly here, there are a few well known pits that get dogs deliberately dumped in. But you wouldn't take a cow caving, and those dogs had no choice poor things.
Children - even young ones - who are good listeners are excellent cavers. I go with one of my best friends and her kids during the week sometimes. Young as three. Pick a cave that is safe and doable, *listen to your f'ing kid* and this doesn't just mean moans of being tired, but also knowing body language of getting tired, and dont push anything. In fact recent we were talking about not taking my friend's eldest caving right now like he wishes because he's hit a fearless 'I know best and can do anything' stage that kids do. So that's all it is, being intelligent about the individual child.
Same for dogs. I wouldn't take most dogs caving, hells no. Heck half the dogs I see at the training facility out of shape, even to do a walk around the neighborhood. Probably 85%of total have shit body awareness. Those dogs should not go caving. For example, Dog's hind feet tend to blindly follow the front so it is something not many dogs are aware of, and has to be worked. The ability to shift weight and recover from stumbles safely, jumping, balance... there are a lot of courses to help teach this (look up FitPaws and TotoFit) and I know Camddwr Canine Ltd is one of the big names for dog fitness and proprioception skills trainers in the UK if you are interested. Dogs who hike karst terrain above ground regularly pick up the skills and I wouldn't see why underground karst would be harder, provided again, proper level cave is picked for the dog.
And a good many dogs and kids alike just don't have the obedience foundation skills. Will they listen to direction? Yes? probably okay then.
Think of it this way, dogs are very common on mountain rescue teams, and that is NOT easy terrain. I don't see terrain as the concern, just the dog's individual skills and training. Some kids are raised hiking and being outdoorsy and active, others sit in front of the tv all day with video games. Again, child's individual ability and skill.