Chilean Mine Rescue

[whitelackington]

No, not tongue in cheek.
We all know mining is a very dangerous trade.
Maybe during the initial stages of the Industrial Revolution, it was thought reasonable to take big risks
but now that PHASE has passed, miners safety should be much more important.
This mine had previously been closed in 2007 because of a not very good safety record.
It was reopened because of the insatiable desire of China for copper.

my point is,
if mines ( after the lode has been tested for viability)
had a preexisting rescue shaft,
if miners had training for using that rescue shaft.

If there was then a collapse, the rescue period may be shortened.
Obviously this would put extra costs on the mine but surely the workers lives are worth more than copper?

 

[ChrisJC]

I thought mines in the UK had to have a second entrance / exit by law, for precisely this reason?

Chris.

 

[Bob Smith]

A ton of material takes up just a couple of cubic metres of space, so the rescue shaft would be errm, right on top of the original access shaft.

Come on Graham, a ton of material takes up less than 1 cubic metre of space  :tease: (unless its specific gravity is less than 1 of course) but your point still stands :hug:

These careless mine owners should quantify all the intangibles before embarking on projects, this way they could manage the colapses in advance.... :

 

[cap n chris]

Should we build a second planet Earth so that when the asteroid is on its way we can quickly hop over to the replacement and avoid the worst excesses of fiery armageddon? The cost of the exercise would be amply justified by the lives saved.

 

[Wolfart]

Congrats to the Chilean's for rescuing the miners at long last after all that time

On that note wasn't there some discussion some time ago about putting a bore hole into Darren ?

 

[AndyF]

I thought mines in the UK had to have a second entrance / exit by law, for precisely this reason?

Chris.

This is true (mostly). Mines in the UK generally have to have two independent entrances (two very adjacent shafts doesn't always count) although some small drift mines can be exempt. Its been like this since the 1860's I think.

Apparently there was a second entrance to the mine, a ventilation shaft, but it became unstable and had its ladders missing.

Wiki has quite a good description of the accident and steps taken, much better than the media has provided..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Copiap%C3%B3_mining_accident

 

[ChrisJC]

So actually, if they'd maintained the ventilation shaft, and not permitted mining to take place unless the ventilation shaft was usable, there would have been no rescue.

Maybe WL has a point  :-\

Chris.

 

[AndyF]

Maybe WL has a point  :-\

:

Well yes.... but:

Obviously this would put extra costs on the mine but surely the workers lives are worth more than copper?

The brutal truth is that copper is worth more to the mine owners.  :doubt: Mining is a worldwide business, if you have standards and another country in Africa or Russia does not then their copper is cheaper. You are out of business and your miners are out of a job.

The UK still has lots of resources, but UK regulations makes most of them non-viable to extract.

Only import protectionism would allow the UK to do the mining, and that just won't happen.

 

[AndyF]

Congrats to the Chilean's for rescuing the miners at long last after all that time

On that note wasn't there some discussion some time ago about putting a bore hole into Darren ?

Wouldn't that count as a second entrance....  :spank:

 

[Les W]

Congrats to the Chilean's for rescuing the miners at long last after all that time

On that note wasn't there some discussion some time ago about putting a bore hole into Darren ?

Wouldn't that count as a second entrance....  :spank:

Fourth entrance actually (or even fifth entrance if you're counting Elm Hole and Pwll y cwm as two) 

 

[mrodoc]

Am I the only one to think that some of this has all got  OTT.  From the medical point of view people have spend longer periods underground without harm. You don't have to go further than Cheddar Gorge for that! There was an indirect reference to the Floyd Collins incident in the Guardian letters page today which said it all.  Yes, an impressive rescue from the engineering point of view but why does it have be so hyped. Something nasty somewhere else happening we should know about?

 

[RobinGriffiths]

I think that it appeals to people's (non cavers that is) worst nightmares, being retrieved through a 2' wide tube half a mile long! In any case I thought the capsule (or it's spungloaded wheels) would be well knackered by now having travelled 20 miles or so.

 

[ChrisJC]

Am I the only one to think that some of this has all got  OTT.  From the medical point of view people have spend longer periods underground without harm. You don't have to go further than Cheddar Gorge for that! There was an indirect reference to the Floyd Collins incident in the Guardian letters page today which said it all.  Yes, an impressive rescue from the engineering point of view but why does it have be so hyped. Something nasty somewhere else happening we should know about?

Please expand - I'm not aware of any unintended incidents at Cheddar that have lasted longer than this one?

Anyway, it's a good news story, which makes a magnificent change from all the doom & gloom that dominates the news normally.

Chris.

 

[graham]

Am I the only one to think that some of this has all got  OTT.  From the medical point of view people have spend longer periods underground without harm. You don't have to go further than Cheddar Gorge for that! There was an indirect reference to the Floyd Collins incident in the Guardian letters page today which said it all.  Yes, an impressive rescue from the engineering point of view but why does it have be so hyped. Something nasty somewhere else happening we should know about?

Please expand - I'm not aware of any unintended incidents at Cheddar that have lasted longer than this one?

Anyway, it's a good news story, which makes a magnificent change from all the doom & gloom that dominates the news normally.

Chris.

Pete was thinking of David Lafferty who reputedly spent 130 days in Gough's Cave. Unintended incidents at Cheddar don't last anywhere near as long. Just ask C**** C***** who managed two in one day.

Anyway, they are all out now so the cynics can find something else to moan about.

 

[ChrisJC]

Pete was thinking of David Lafferty who reputedly spent 130 days in Gough's Cave. Unintended incidents at Cheddar don't last anywhere near as long. Just ask C**** C***** who managed two in one day.

Ah, so entirely different then. Comparing a planned record-breaking underground stay (presumably with sufficient necessities), and an unplanned mine collapse with totally inadequate provisions and the psychological effects of the likelyhood of a prolonged death by starvation.......... Apples & apples.

Chris.

 

[Les W]

Unintended incidents at Cheddar don't last anywhere near as long. Just ask C**** C***** who managed two in one day.

:spank:

 

 

[Roger W]

Anyway, it's great news that they got them all out safely!

 

[Roger W]

Regarding certain other thoughts and suggestions in this thread...

Surely whenever you get people digging/tunneling mining away from open passage (however many entrances there may be to said open passage) there may be some possibility or danger that a roof fall or other event may trap them at the end of their tunnel?

So should all you cave diggers ensure your own safety by having an escape route dug from the surface to wherever you are digging to before you start digging?     

 

[Les W]

So should all you cave diggers ensure your own safety by having an escape route dug from the surface to wherever you are digging to before you start digging?     

It's a good point. I will raise it at the next BCA council meeting. I'm sure with the right lobbying of government we can get it into UK law in the next session of Parliament.    :-\

 

[mrodoc]

I thought my posting would prove provocative! I agree that some of the circumstances are different but we do know that just being underground for long periods is not specifically detrimental to your health. Once the miners had been located they had the advantage of being orientated in time, able to communicate with family and be provided with medication.  I heard talk of vision problems from being underground, decompression issues (people always ask why it isn't hot or airless in caves) etc. etc. This is what I meant by OTT. It starts to make you cynical about many things one hears or is told in the press.