Club Conservation

[graham]

An interesting dictionary definition of conservation:

planned management of a natural resource to prevent exploitation, destruction, or neglect

IMHO the important words here are the first two: planned management. That means more than just taping, it includes all the things mentioned by Leclused and more. It includes stuff like education, of course*, but it allows for the fact that education won't reach everybody very quickly, so, yes it does include gates and leader ('conservation warden') systems.


*though I agree with Chris that this is much mentioned in discussions like this but rarely, it would seem carried out in practice.

 

[cap n chris]

Conservation starts with discovery. What to do as soon as a cave is found and exploration starts. After that, what areas of the cave are deemed fine for footfall and which are not is going to be a judgement that will vary according to the nature of the site and what features are deemed worthy of serious protection - deposits, formations, wildlife, archaeology, and in the case of mines, artefacts, formations, minerals, inscriptions, archaeology. Teaching all this is far more of a challenge than cleaning and restoring. However, a good dose of restoration might soon instil in cavers a better sense of what not to do in a cave, and what measures might make a cave easier to look after in the long term.

Thanks for this (and Graham's subsequent post).

For the sake of this thread I'd like to define conservation as those practices which are relevant to ALL CAVERS who are involved in routine visits to established sports caves, rather than the lucky few who persevere often for years to discover pristine passages and chambers (and the subsequent moral imperative of looking after them as best as is possible).

With this in mind I'd like to concentrate on the types of things that sports cavers can, ought, should, could, might do to best improve the wellbeing of the caves they like to visit. Hence the kind of things likely to be found in a conservation code leaflet or minimum impact caving code, rather than the types of considerations involved in drafting a conservation management plan for a new discovery (which is a very different thing altogether, although it has relevance and cross-over, once it has been published).

 

[Leclused]

An interesting dictionary definition of conservation:

planned management of a natural resource to prevent exploitation, destruction, or neglect

IMHO the important words here are the first two: planned management. That means more than just taping, it includes all the things mentioned by Leclused and more. It includes stuff like education, of course*, but it allows for the fact that education won't reach everybody very quickly, so, yes it does include gates and leader ('conservation warden') systems.


*though I agree with Chris that this is much mentioned in discussions like this but rarely, it would seem carried out in practice.

Gates and guided trips is exactly what we do in several of our discoveries. In the cave Bois de  Waerimont we do 6 guided trips  a year. Each time 2 groups of 3 cavers with one guide who knows all the handling in the cave. This includes undressing and progression in undersuit,...

So it is possible to carry it out in practice but you need a group to support it. And that is not always the case.

And what Peter wrotes is also true, conservation starts at the time of discovery. This means just Before you enter a virgin passage.  This means that you need to wait to enter a new passage when you don't have the correct equipment with you. But also when you are to muddy for example, and your undersuit is not clean enough. It's very diffuclt to stop then but it is necessary. One trip in dirty suites in a decorated passage can ruin it completely.

 

[jasonbirder]

Blimey!

If we haven't managed to shoehorn in "Southern" caving's two favourite hobby-horses in one thread...

Formal Training/Guidelines for club cavers...

AND

Locked Gates/Leader Only Caves !!!

Makes me glad I'm oop north!

 

[cap n chris]

We like to gallop with our hobby horses, Jason! Tally ho!

 

[jasonbirder]

 

[Peter Burgess]

Makes me glad I'm oop north!

The feeling is mutual! 

 

[Leclused]

An interesting dictionary definition of conservation:

planned management of a natural resource to prevent exploitation, destruction, or neglect

IMHO the important words here are the first two: planned management. That means more than just taping, it includes all the things mentioned by Leclused and more. It includes stuff like education, of course*, but it allows for the fact that education won't reach everybody very quickly, so, yes it does include gates and leader ('conservation warden') systems.


*though I agree with Chris that this is much mentioned in discussions like this but rarely, it would seem carried out in practice.

And what Peter wrotes is also true, conservation starts at the time of discovery. This means just Before you enter a virgin passage.  This means that you need to wait to enter a new passage when you don't have the correct equipment with you. But also when you are to muddy for example, and your undersuit is not clean enough. It's very diffuclt to stop then but it is necessary. One trip in dirty suites in a decorated passage can ruin it completely.

The following clips shows an exploration trip in one of our discoveries
http://files.getdropbox.com/u/1068395/Movies/Diverse%20Explos%20Belgie/Doorbraak%20Cotes%2021072009.wmv

During this trip we undressed at a certain point and towards the end we looked into a new gallery. But we were to dirty and did not enter this part until next visit These are very hard moments, but you need to be aware of your condition at that time.

 

[Caver Keith]

During a recent visit to Shatter Cave, one of Britain's best decorated caves, the team undertook some delicate and sensitive conservation work.

http://youtu.be/b76xemWicdo

 

[And]

Maybe the Descent Adopt-a-Cave could be better publicised. I don't really hear much about it. Perhaps Descent can publish (in print or online) brief updates of the work that clubs have done in their caves, including just general checks that the cave is ok.

 

[cap n chris]

So far so good (or not).

SC Avalon, Buttered Badgers, Red Rose, WCMS.... I know these are clubs with a great conservation track record.

Any more? Apparently there's six more clubs according to the poll that are involved in regular clear-ups, litter picking, stal cleaning - they might want to fly their flag and make their good deeds more public so they serve as a shining example (see what I did there?) to others. Photos of works would be excellent.

 

[Chocolate fireguard]

So far so good (or not).

SC Avalon, Buttered Badgers, Red Rose, WCMS.... I know these are clubs with a great conservation track record.

Any more? Apparently there's six more clubs according to the poll that are involved in regular clear-ups, litter picking, stal cleaning - they might want to fly their flag and make their good deeds more public so they serve as a shining example (see what I did there?) to others. Photos of works would be excellent.

Of course all 10 people from your option 5 (and indeed all of the other 17 people) could be from the same club, perhaps not even one of the 4 you have listed.
Many cavers don't know everything about what goes on in their clubs but could have chosen the options in good faith.

 

[Leclused]

So far so good (or not).

SC Avalon, Buttered Badgers, Red Rose, WCMS.... I know these are clubs with a great conservation track record.

Any more? Apparently there's six more clubs according to the poll that are involved in regular clear-ups, litter picking, stal cleaning - they might want to fly their flag and make their good deeds more public so they serve as a shining example (see what I did there?) to others. Photos of works would be excellent.

Of course all 10 people from your option 5 (and indeed all of the other 17 people) could be from the same club, perhaps not even one of the 4 you have listed.
Many cavers don't know everything about what goes on in their clubs but could have chosen the options in good faith.

At least one of the 4 listed one is for sure

C'mon show your conservation efforts  big and little We can all learn about it, perhaps you use a different technique that works better then the ones we already know.

 

[cap n chris]

Of course all 10 people from your option 5 (and indeed all of the other 17 people) could be from the same club

You are correct and I didn't consider that. Me = stooopids!

 

[kay]

Northern Boggarts and BPC are just two of the Northern clubs active in conservation, particularly surface works (they just happen to be the ones I know most about).

Northern Boggarts conservation videos here
http://northernboggarts.org.uk/youtube/conservation

The Northern Caves Monitoring Scheme carries out conservation work, as well as regular monitoring of the condition of caves across the Dales.
http://www.northerncavemonitoring.org.uk/

I'm sure the other regions and many of the clubs are doing similar stuff.

 

[paul]

Northern Boggarts and BPC are just two of the Northern clubs active in conservation, particularly surface works (they just happen to be the ones I know most about).

Northern Boggarts conservation videos here
http://northernboggarts.org.uk/youtube/conservation

The Northern Caves Monitoring Scheme carries out conservation work, as well as regular monitoring of the condition of caves across the Dales.
http://www.northerncavemonitoring.org.uk/

I'm sure the other regions and many of the clubs are doing similar stuff.

Yes, it's been going on in the Peak for quite a few years: http://www.peakcavemonitoring.org.uk/

 

[cap n chris]

I'm sure the other regions and many of the clubs are doing similar stuff.

Possibly correct. It would be interesting to know approximately how many though, out of the total. e.g. are most cavers conservation-minded or is it just a single digit percentage?

 

[cap n chris]

CSCC started active involvement with the English Nature SSSI Cave Monitoring scheme WAY back in 2003. All the files are available. Just haven't got a fancy pants website.

 

[paul]

CSCC started active involvement with the English Nature SSSI Cave Monitoring scheme WAY back in 2003. All the files are available. Just haven't got a fancy pants website.

"The Peak District SSSI Cave Conservation Monitoring Scheme, to give it its full title, was set up in 2002"

See http://www.orpheuscavingclub.org.uk/links.html (not a fancy pants website)

 

[graham]

CSCC started active involvement with the English Nature SSSI Cave Monitoring scheme WAY back in 2003. All the files are available. Just haven't got a fancy pants website.

"The Peak District SSSI Cave Conservation Monitoring Scheme, to give it its full title, was set up in 2002"

See http://www.orpheuscavingclub.org.uk/links.html (not a fancy pants website)

The original conservation plans for caves on land administered by CCC Ltd were drawn up in 1995. Monitoring has taken place on a regular basis ever since, along with restoration work as and when required. The plans have recently been renewed after consultation between ourselves, Somerset Wildlife Trust and Natural England. The latest iterations can be found by following the links on this page. If the plans look familiar then it may be because the one in the original NCA Conservation Handbook was based on the GB plan. Twenty years on and NE still regard them as being fit for purpose.