P8 Sand passage.

[DAN]

Rob Evis, Simon Gant and I had a trip into P8 last night, we Bailed the sump into Sand passage and went to the end for a look. The Sump at the the end looks Excellent wished i had a Camera to prove it 1.2 by 2 meters long with a good space to kit up. The sump has been bailed and should take little effort to clear if anyone fancys a look, its a helmet off and nose against the roof job so not for the faint hearted and the slope on the way back is a bit hard if your not Rob evis sized.

Dan

 

[Rob]

Indeed, a very interesting trip. 

Has anyone on here dived the end sump?

 

[Pitlamp]

Someone has; the sump index says "a pool may have to be bailed to reach this sump" and states the sump is 1 m x 1.5 m and "choked at -4 m". (I do have a vague memory of it being dived but I wasn't on the trip; it might have been Jim Davenport who did it. If so, Orpheus log books might be a productive source of information?)

I don't have a CDG reference immediately to hand but it may be worth checking:

Bentham K, 1990, "P8 Sumps, A Short History Of Exploration". Descent 91 (Dec 1989 / Jan 1990) page 29.

 

[DAN]

Phil Burke Dived it, which must be a very long time ago. He says he Dived it on one cylinder and  he was a bit uncomfortable, which is not surprising as anyone who have been there will know the air quickly becomes toxic. I was under the impression it needs another look after talking with Phil. On sunday if all goes acording to plan John Taylor and I will have a look and see if we come to the same conclusion.  Has anyone got any idea if carbon monoxide and carbon Dioxide are absorbed by water or if they will naturally dissapear given time? And has anyone else dived this sump other than Phil B to save us the trouble of carting our gear in there sunday?

Dan

 

[Brains]

Carbon monoxide is relatively short lived as its so reactive so wont be an issue unless you have coal or an internal combustion engine handy. CO2 is more persistent and will dissolve in water, but without flow of air or water it will achieve an equilibrium.

 

[DAN]

There is a sump at the bottom of the slope which should help!

Dan

 

[Brains]

Had a look in there many moons ago, seem to remember a low grovel in a gravelly puddle leading to a short tube that looped over to a sump that looked static - is this the duck you bailed, or was it the gravelly puddle that I found (this was a flat out crawl)?

 

[DAN]

You Bail the first sump, which is constricted low and wet, nose against the roof helmet of job. Then there is a passage which zig zags to another low wet section, which again means helmet of nose against the roof. After passing the 2nd wet section there is a short hands and knees crawl to a descending muddy tube which is tight, after that it gets a little bigger before the sump which has not been named. The bigger bit is plenty big enough to get kitted up to dive comfortably.

Dan

 

[Brains]

Sounds like the first was "dry" when I was there but the second was not. Sounds an interesting project

 

[DAN]

Breathing is the main concern!

Dan

 

[Pitlamp]

Dan - I've flicked through the last 30 years of CDG Newsletters and didn't spot any reference to this sump. I can go back further and look for you if you like but I suspect that Phil never got round to sending in his dive log.

 

[Cave_Troll]

Am i thinking about the right place? turn left before the other upstream sumps, climb up a bit, small U bend then up a bit more and then a passage angled steeply down?

If so i was there a few years ago when it was all dry. one of our part descended down the tube, but it all got a bit steep and we had no ladder or rope to pull him out so we didn't push it.

 

[DAN]

That is the correct place!

 

[John B]

Had a look in the database and came up with this in Eldon Journal Vol 8. No.1 1972:

"The first obstacle is a large notice in the 6? high, 3? wide passage announcing the danger of foul air. Take some breathing apparatus, or a deep breath or something but we haven?t experienced any respiratory trouble here. Within 40? the passage is hands and knees crawling size though quite comfortable on the sand and gravel floor. A tight tube on the North East wall leads to Top Sump. A few yards on is a duck, short but rather constricted and gruesome, beyond which the passage is much bigger, being a tube 3? in diameter rising steadily as it zig-zags westwards to a point 120? from the Main Stream Passage. Here is a sordid pool, which isn?t the end. A few minutes baling will open up a tight and watery crawl to a steeply descending mud crawl to a sump pool 3? wide and 5? long on a mineral vein. In this area the air does become rather thick, maybe because of the extravagant praise lavished on the scenery by cavers misguided enough to visit this spot. The identity of this sump pool is in question because on the BSA survey Sump IV seems to refer to the baled pool: on the other hand the CDG?s Sump E does seem to be here. Although not recorded anywhere the sump has been dived by D.Sinclair, who came to a full stop at a depth of 15? under the far wall."

Doesn't give much new info. but at least it states who dived it.

 

[SamT]

A fine description!!!