Pantin Technique
- Thread starter Madness
- Start date
David Rose
Active member
If a Croll is slipping, it's time to change it. I would suggest you get a Climbing Technology chest ascender. Come to that, CT footloop and foot ascenders are, in my opinion, better and more robust than modern versions of their Petzl counterparts, too. The CT foot jammer is more like an old style Pantin.
alastairgott
Well-known member
Madness said:
I don't own a Pantin, but I'm sure the Flappy bit flaps (down) at the back of the device, with the pivot at the front (The Teeth also point downwards). Once you've sussed that and put it between your legs you'll probably see which side the straps come out of the device.
Right will have the straps on the Right of the Device and Left will have the Straps on the Left of the Device.
Place the pantin on the inside of your foot, hook the Heel into the strap first, then buckle the strap over the front.
Trying to get left vs right is only going to get more difficult as more brands/colours come in, easier to know from base principles which foot it should be on.
Chocolate fireguard
Active member
Mattrees said:Chocolate fireguard said:
How did you? Bring foot high enough to disengage by hand?
I didn't want to bend my leg any more than it was already, because I wasn't sure when I was going to be able to straighten it again!
The person below came higher, took the weight of the sack and (if I remember) disengaged the Pantin as I raised my foot slightly.
Without that help I can't think of anything I could have done apart from cut the donkey's dick. Then it would have been a bit of a kerfuffle trying to stop the sack falling down the pitch.
Of course without somebody else on the rope it would not have happened in the first place.
As an aside, we both found the Pantin to be worse than useless for the top person on a tandem - we had tandemed the previous pitch, but with her as lead climber.
With the weight of a person on the rope below it is difficult to get the Pantin to move freely up the rope. I didn't understand why that should be so, and I haven't tried since.
JasonC
Well-known member
skippy said:
Yes - but only when I'd inadvertently put the croll on the wrong way round, so that it rested at right-angles to my chest rather than flat. Somebody pointed it out, but I thought "don't fuss, it'll be reet", but it wasn't really... There's a lesson there, somewhere
Simon Wilson
New member
I think there is a possibilty that some people struggle because they are not using a pantin on the best foot. Other people might not completely agree with this. I think you need to first ask yourself the question, which is my strongest foot? If you were prusicking with one leg, which leg would it be? If you answer, the right foot, then you need to buy a left foot Pantin and put it on your left foot.
That's what I did and I took to it straight away. I had a bit of joint trouble with my left ankle so I thought I'd try the other foot and I bought a right foot Pantin. I gave it a good go over quite a few caving trips but I was never anywhere near as happy as with a Pantin on my left foot and felt that I would never fully master it.
Maybe other people are happy with whatever Pantin they start with, maybe some people don't favour one leg as much and maybe some people can use a Pantin on either foot - I don't know.
That's what I did and I took to it straight away. I had a bit of joint trouble with my left ankle so I thought I'd try the other foot and I bought a right foot Pantin. I gave it a good go over quite a few caving trips but I was never anywhere near as happy as with a Pantin on my left foot and felt that I would never fully master it.
Maybe other people are happy with whatever Pantin they start with, maybe some people don't favour one leg as much and maybe some people can use a Pantin on either foot - I don't know.
pwhole
Well-known member
I'm 'right-footed', and never got on with the Pantin there, so bought a left and never looked back. I think your strongest leg should always be in the footloop. Just to confuse matters on straps, when I bought a replacement 'old style' strap, I found out that Petzl only supplied 'right' versions. So on both of my current Pantins the straps are on backwards, though it still works the same. And as Alastair mentioned, it's always on the inside of the foot, with the cam facing backwards.
Simon Wilson
New member
pwhole said:
Since most people are right footed, if most people prefer a Pantin on the other foot then I would expect Petzl to sell more left foot Pantins and replacement straps. Do most people prefer a Pantin on the opposite foot to their leading foot? Which side Pantin sells most?
pwhole
Well-known member
Weirdly, Petzl used to advise against using a left-footed Pantin if you were right-handed, as it could make passing rebelays more difficult, though I still struggle to see how. Their explanation of the 'problem' was baffling, but I thought maybe it lost a little in the translation.
And how come no-one ever makes a left-handed chest ascender, while we're at it? All the other bits of ascending kit have both options. It seems a bit unfair on left-handers that's all, as undoing your chest ascender can be a rather important operation! Any left-handers find it a problem?
And how come no-one ever makes a left-handed chest ascender, while we're at it? All the other bits of ascending kit have both options. It seems a bit unfair on left-handers that's all, as undoing your chest ascender can be a rather important operation! Any left-handers find it a problem?
Mike Hopley
New member
pwhole said:
The theory is that your footloop and safety cord should be "on the same side" -- so if your safety cord is to the left of your chest jammer, your footloop should go on your left leg.
The "standard" French setup puts cowstails on the left, and uses the long cowstail as the safety cord. If the footloop is then on the right foot, they say the footloop "crosses the rope" at rebelays. Their recommendation is then to use two separate cowstails, with the long cowstail on the right (and threaded through the harness closure, to keep it away from the chest jammer).
I have to confess I have never quite understood this. I find it very hard to visualise the problem. Maybe I should just try it and see.
I think what they're getting at is that you should be able to pass rebelays without removing your foot from the footloop, and without removing your safety cord from the jammer. But it seems to me you can do this anyway.
pwhole
Well-known member
Ah right - I see. They do seem to make it more confusing than necessary. In my book, cowstails are cowstails, and not to be used 'part time' as an ascender link - I usually need both of them. I always use a separate dynamic rope link to my hand jammer, on the right, with a steel krab attached for no damage when clipping to plate anchors, so effectively have three cowstails (four if you include the short loop between my two main ones!), and never have any problems passing rebelays - the Pantin is usually the last thing to come off, as it's so handy to stand on whilst sorting everything else out. I guess they're just tight with their rope!
Mike Hopley
New member
Eh, there are pros & cons of both approaches. The French would argue that having fewer cords is simpler, and the long cowstail isn't doing anything when you're ascending. Brits will argue that having the extra cowstail simplifies things like getting off the pitch head.
In my experience, people tend to confuse "familiar" with "simple", and "unfamiliar" with "confusing". That's not a dig at anyone, just a general observation! It can be surprisingly hard to distance oneself from the familiar.
cap n chris
Well-known member
You must read and understand all the instructions for use, and get specific instruction in its use, before using it. So say Petzl; it's on the technical sheet, first page, can't miss it.
AR
Well-known member
I once made the mistake of putting my right-foot pantin on the left foot, then on starting the ascent finding it kept coming off. Unfortunately, I worked this out 30ft up the Knotlow engine shaft so had the choice of swapping it to the right foot mid-air and risking dropping it into the sump, doing a mid-rope changeover and going back down to change over, or two-foot frogging to the top. Frogging won....
pwhole
Well-known member
Putting on a Pantin whilst on a rope is probably wonderful exercise, but miserable at the time. I once spent a good five minutes slowly swinging back and forth on the first proper pitch up Block Hall in Speedwell after forgetting to put it on, trying to contort myself enough to fasten my (backward) straps, with my climbing partner chortling away below. I was completely exhausted by the time I finally got it on, and had to have a sit down.
