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"Simpson" Pot confirmation

Pitlamp

Well-known member
There was discussion in various editions of Descent magazine over recent years about the correct name of Simpson Pot in Kingsdale. Most evidence points to the commonly used "Simpson's" being wrong. Not quite everyone accepted this. (For anyone who wants to look into the minutiae I suggest reading these useful correspondences, which argued for both versions.)

Whilst looking through Steve Warren's phenomenally useful website ( http://www.mudinmyhair.co.uk/ ) I came across two large scale maps onto which Eli "Cymmie" Simpson had drawn on the geology and assorted caves. (To find this select "The Craven Faults" from the menu on the left; scroll down [trying not to be distracted by the magnificent photographs] and click on the right hand of the two maps at the bottom of the page.)

There, in Cymmie's own handwriting, is "Simpson Pot".

Cymmie was the discoverer of Simpson Pot shortly before the first world war (although others extended it much later, at his suggestion) so the name Cymmie used must be taken as definitive.

I rest my case; "SIMPSON POT" it is.
 

Pitlamp

Well-known member
On looking at Langcliffes map - Shouldn't Lost Johns have an a apostrophe and be Lost Johns'?

Pleeeease don't open that can of worms . . . ! :LOL:

It was discussed at length when Tony Waltham & Deej Lowe's two volumes of Caves & Karst of the Yorkshire Dales were being produced a few years ago. As I remember a definitive answer wasn't possible.

(But this topic is just about Simpson Pot.)
 

Frog2

Member
Pleeeease don't open that can of worms . . . ! :LOL:

It was discussed at length when Tony Waltham & Deej Lowe's two volumes of Caves & Karst of the Yorkshire Dales were being produced a few years ago. As I remember a definitive answer wasn't possible.

(But this topic is just about Simpson Pot.)
Sorry!
 

Pitlamp

Well-known member
Ha ha . . . . !

If I can be allowed my own little digression from the original subject, one of the more common errors in the Dales is that folk frequently get Robinsons' Pot wrong. (There were definitely two Robinsons at Darnbrook Farm, after whom the pot was [re?]named when it was rediscovered in 1975.)
 

mikem

Well-known member
It's a fair question Frog2; quite involved that one.
Shirley this is definitive ;):

A more useful bit of history, but not definitive:
 
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langcliffe

Well-known member
Shirley this is definitive ;):

A more useful bit of history, but not definitive:

The earliest reference I know is in Balderstone, published circa 1881. In the section discussing Lost Johns' (page 69-70) he writes:

"At the lower end of that portion of the field which is above the road there is a slight hollow, becoming deeper at the point where it meets the boundary wall, and in this depression is the mouth of Lost Johns' Cave, sometimes called "John is coming Hole," owing to two men—both of whom were named John—having once, after their candles had gone out, utterly lost their way."

Unfortunately, on page 40 he refers to "Lost John's"!
 

Pitlamp

Well-known member
"Shirley this is definitive"

Is there a typo here Mike or are you a fan of the "Airplane" film?! (Sorry, coundn't resist.)
 

mikem

Well-known member
It seemed appropriate for a "write up" from a computer game!

Books in the 1880s were subject to the vagaries of typesetters when it came to apostrophes (they had to put in the letters back to front)
 
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