who did giants/oxlow connection first?

[langcliffe]

Cool, thanx. Now bookmarked. Will make an enquiry shortly when I get time. 

Guess it will involve me scanning everything then zipping up the images or putting them into pdf files...

I think the first stage is to establish how many images there would be, and estimate the storage requirements. With that information, you will then be able to make a case to the aforementioned Ms. Potts for storing the digital images in the archives.

Because a pre-existing package was used to implement the digital archives, the contents are actually stored as JPEGs. If approval is given, PM me and I will advise on the sizes and file structure required.

You will probably have seen that the LUSS journals are already on the digital archive.

 

[Groundhog]

To get back to the original question, I have been told by one who was there that it was Dave Gill who got through first after the tight bit at Mecca Aven had been blasted. Followed by Phil Burke, Clive Westlake, Paul Deakin, Chris Burrows and 2 others (maybe not in that order) after more blasting had been done.  :bow:

In the early days there was not much water in the Chamber of Horrors (it wasn't called that then).
It slowly filled, by 72 there was little air space.

 

[mr conners]

Thanks groundhog.
Was it early sixties? Im slowly being put off the idea
All the talk of no air and cold water.

 

[Groundhog]

I think Allan above is correct in saying May 66.
I will not be going through there again and several other cavers I know, who are well 'ard, say the same.

 

[Allan]

According to the article in the Eldon Journal, neither Phil Burke or Chris Burrows were involved at any time with the dig (unless one of them is known as wingnut).
Pete Smith suggested the name of Chamber of Horrors, this was after the breakthrough, but before the article was written in 1966.
Dave Gill was not in the party which got through first.  He had though, spent four hours with Steve Hoyle chipping at the final squeeze, one Sunday before the breakthrough, but was unable to get through at the time.
The name Mecca Aven does not appear in the article.

 

[Goydenman]

Thanks groundhog.
Was it early sixties? Im slowly being put off the idea
All the talk of no air and cold water.

I did the trip 3 times twice Oxlow to Giants and once the other way. Water definately at that time met the roof in more than one spot which was worrying the first time because I was not 100% I was in the right place  . Even worse for guy who followed me because he paniced and I helped him get through. Told me after he has aquaphobia and I found out this was true. Wish he had told me - mind you as he suspected I would have probably not agreed to take him which is why he kept quiet about it. Impressed with his courage.

 

[Groundhog]

Hmmm seems we have conflicting information here. I have only repeated what I was told.
I should be able to contact some more of the people involved and clear things up.....

 

[Allan]

I am copying information from a document written just after the event in 1966.
Mind you those in power tend to write the history books 

 

[Groundhog]

Thats great Alan. It would be good to clear this up. Probably though we will just get more confused!
Memory is not reliable thing. I have had lots of interesting discussions with old friends. We can never agree on what actually happened a long time after an event.
Also, as you say, history is written by the winners, or perhaps whoever had a typewriter at the time.

 

[Pitlamp]

I bumped into Clive Westlake yesterday and asked him about this. He told me that the first person to pass between the two was actually Henry Mares. Clive had a lot of input to the project in the months leading up to the breakthrough but he missed the breakthrough trip because he was doing finals at university at the time. (Which suggests late spring as mentioned above.)

 

[Clive Westlake]

I have in front of me the letter written to me by Paul Deakin on 23rd May 1966.He wrote that the day before Henry Mares,followed by Al Watt,Ron Bridger,Bernard Parkin and Paul himself passed the tight squeeze from Oxlow Cavern to Giant's Hole.They then continued to Geology Pot,where they met cavers from Sheffield Technical College.The two teams then continued to the East Canal,then some went out of Giant's Hole and some out of Oxlow Cavern,including one of the Sheffield Tech. cavers who thought the Crabwalk was too tight! The Eldon cavers were underground for six hours.For 15 months the Giant's - Oxlow system was the deepest cave in Britain.

This letter is one of several written to me by Paul about the Giant's - Oxlow connection.I'd done many digging trips during the Easter vacation,but as John explains was back at university when the connection was made.

Yours to the final sump,
Clive.

 

[mr conners]

Thanks clive. What a brilliant effort.
Talk about commitment.
:bow:

 

[Allan]

In the Eldon article, Al Watt is not included in the breakthrough party, but he was present a couple of weeks earlier when a handshake connection through the final squeeze was achieved.
So who is correct? I have the original article, Clive has a letter written just after the event.  Can anyone shed any more light on this mystery? 

 

[Dickie]

In the words of the prophet - Does it really matter?

We know which club did it - the Eldon of course - and who was first through, Henry.

(Although Ron Bridger must have been a bit thinner in those days!!!!)

Hell's Teeth Clive, I'd completely forgotten about your trademark sign-off "Yours to the final sump" - brings back great memories!

 

[Groundhog]

Thanks for clearing that up at last Clive, I've sent you a pm on another matter.

 

[Jopo]

In the words of the prophet - Does it really matter?

In the great scheme of human history - probably not. In terms of caving history yes.

Jopo

 

[Mrs Trellis]

Today is my 65th birthday. It's sobering to reflect that those heroes mentioned will now be retired or , in the case of Henry Mares at least, no longer around.

I'll be singing in the George on Sunday night with Wacker and we light a candle next to some ore on one of the tables.

If anyone has a photo of Henry - post it on this thread and I'll print it and take it up to the George on Sunday.

 

[Pitlamp]

Congratulations on your birthday Mrs.T.

I'm sure someone will have a picture of HM but, in case it helps, wasn't there a full A4 page image of him along with that superbly written obituary in the Eldon journal?

 

[Dickie]

I'm sure someone will have a picture of HM but, in case it helps, wasn't there a full A4 page image of him along with that superbly written obituary in the Eldon journal?

Volume 9 No.2 1979 to be precise - I'm looking at it right now.

 

[Lutonron]

Henry was first and did a first class job but even he had a struggle . I cannot remember if Al Watts was next but at this point following a short discussion it was agreed that if i could not get thro then some more work would be needed at the very tight point (but it all seemed tight). I some how managed to get thro even thro i could not take full breaths as my chest would not expand . Yes Dickie i was a bit thinner then. A number of other Eldon members did a lot of hard work before this happened.I am sure that Pauls write up was in the Eldon Log Book - who ever's got them now ?
regards
Ron Bridger