C
cavespen
Guest
anyone know what the knew petzl XP myo is like.
Stupot
Active member
The only contact i have had with one was 2 weeks ago on Dartmoor when someone blinded me with one whilst in the pub, now i was slightly under the influence of Jale Ale, but i can confirm it was very bright and i informed the person just how bright i thought it was using a combination of widly used unprintable words :evil:
Not sure about undergroud though.
MYO 3 or 5 probably a better option as you get a nice Zenon bulb aswel.
Stu.
Not sure about undergroud though.
MYO 3 or 5 probably a better option as you get a nice Zenon bulb aswel.
Stu.
I've been using my MYO XP for caving over the last month or so and i'm very impressed indeed. Excellent level of light, easy to use, very light on the helmet, lasts forever! - I can see no disadvantages at all over 'conventional' caving light sets for relatively unarduous caving trips.
It is only'water resistant' which may be an issue depending on what sort of things you get up to underground!! Also I'm not quite sure as to how robust it is - so it might not get first choice for a tight digging trip into Easegill for example. Time will tell.....
It is only'water resistant' which may be an issue depending on what sort of things you get up to underground!! Also I'm not quite sure as to how robust it is - so it might not get first choice for a tight digging trip into Easegill for example. Time will tell.....
T
tubby two
Guest
Yeah, i've never used one caving but thay are brilliant lights- the only thing is, if, like me, you crawl along bouncing your head off every avaliable bit of roof i dont think they are gonna last too long, especially when i look at all the scratches and dents in my speleoshite...?
tt.
tt.
SamT
Moderator
couldnt agree more tt.
its been aluded to earlier in theis thread, I've said it before - and I'll say it again.
Caves and mines in all their forms are hostile environments. If you are going to explore them, get kitted up. Most petzl head torchs stuff is just not durable enough for the underground environment.
Its no use being in some cave somewhere in the dark complaining that it was fine in all the other caves/mines where you could walk about in the dry but now
a - leaked water and is not working properly cause its only 'water resistant'
b - smashed to bits cause you've bumped it off the roof a few times.
c - generally a pain in the neck cause the elastic wotsit is trashed and no longer elastic and falls off you head all the time.
If you want to go camping and hiking, maybe even get benighted on a scotish winter route. - get a myo.
If you want to go caving - get yourself an oldham headset and a battery pack/led setup/main beam that suits your tastes/requirement and stop pissing about wasting your money on poxy plastic kiddys toy headlights.
[/rant]
its been aluded to earlier in theis thread, I've said it before - and I'll say it again.
Caves and mines in all their forms are hostile environments. If you are going to explore them, get kitted up. Most petzl head torchs stuff is just not durable enough for the underground environment.
Its no use being in some cave somewhere in the dark complaining that it was fine in all the other caves/mines where you could walk about in the dry but now
a - leaked water and is not working properly cause its only 'water resistant'
b - smashed to bits cause you've bumped it off the roof a few times.
c - generally a pain in the neck cause the elastic wotsit is trashed and no longer elastic and falls off you head all the time.
If you want to go camping and hiking, maybe even get benighted on a scotish winter route. - get a myo.
If you want to go caving - get yourself an oldham headset and a battery pack/led setup/main beam that suits your tastes/requirement and stop pissing about wasting your money on poxy plastic kiddys toy headlights.
[/rant]
D
darkplaces
Guest
Totally aggree Sam...
Spent loads of money in the past buying nice looking plastic head torches. Only to keep returning to my proper lamp.
What we need is a wider range of Luxeon builbs (LEDs) for existing tried and tested robust headlamps. I wanna proper 7volt 5+watt side emitting screw in LED.
Spent loads of money in the past buying nice looking plastic head torches. Only to keep returning to my proper lamp.
What we need is a wider range of Luxeon builbs (LEDs) for existing tried and tested robust headlamps. I wanna proper 7volt 5+watt side emitting screw in LED.
L
Louis
Guest
I use a Duo 8 LED, pretty bashproof (so far!), completely waterproof, but expensive (I do think 10p for a chomp is a rip-off though). Trouble, is there's nothing much else. I could carry a stupid lump on my hips. But I don't want a NiCad and speleo crapnics stuff is built out of lego. If I use a old zoom box, rechargeables get ruined and the contacts have to be continualy replaced. Plus they don't stay on your helmet forever. What I want really, is a Duo battery box attached to an oldham headset, with a 0.5W LED pilot and say a 2-3W LED main beam. If anyone wants to build me one for free...
You can get 1.6W luxeon LED replacements for 3V, 4.5V and 6V systems. Bout £20 a pop. 5W of Luxeon LED is... a lot! What do you want it for? Something specific, or to make people in front of you fall over! God thats a fun game. :twisted:
You can get 1.6W luxeon LED replacements for 3V, 4.5V and 6V systems. Bout £20 a pop. 5W of Luxeon LED is... a lot! What do you want it for? Something specific, or to make people in front of you fall over! God thats a fun game. :twisted:
D
darkplaces
Guest
I just want plenty of light for hours.. I most explore old mines etc so the area I am in is much larger, consistant. yes caves can be HUGE and I light to light them up well as well. A 3 builb or level system would be ideal. Pilot for 'resting' or map reading. Medium for normal walking passages, caves crawling. MEGA BRIGHT for large & dark caves & mines. Slate mines or mineral mines which are very dark soak up the light (or seam to) so a bright light in say box would feel very dim in say Rampghill or slatemines in northwales. I guess I am describing the NOVA... But I dont wanna spend £100 when I already have a FX5 headset and battery and charger. I would rather mod or convert it. I already have a 1.5watt Luxeon as pilot. I have modded 5 watt luxeons in a headset which works but needs more of a beam (hence the side emmitting requirement). Luxeons are not that expensive, its when they are added to a screwbase and remarketted the price pops up. Greedy HnK 
L
Louis
Guest
It's a pain how rubbish cave lighting is. I see your point about lots of light, been down the slate mines in Blaenau Ffestiniog (touristy thing [bit dodgy, send you round without a guide] and they had car headlight type things to light up the chambers [or whatever they call the big room type things in slate mines]). You could look at HID (High Intensity Discharge) stuff. They sell it for mountain bikes, so should be fairly robust. Meant to be able to get stuff as bright as a car headlamp. Pricey though, I think.
T
twllddu
Guest
Anyone tried one of these
http://www.bisun.co.uk/ ?
http://www.bisun.co.uk/ ?
Cave_Troll
Active member
so that £75 for jsut the LED and reflector?
headset, cable and battery box extra ?
headset, cable and battery box extra ?
D
darkplaces
Guest
Looks like it, might as well add a couple of tenners and get a NOVA. Atleast you will get 5 watts, not 1watt as with the B17. For £20 you can buy a screw in LED from H&K but they are not providing a side emmitting which is what you want.
M
Mole
Guest
I don't know why Darkplaces wants a 5 Watt LED,I find a 1 Watt LED main beam more than adequate.
I thought the idea was to get the same level of illumination from a smaller/lighter battery pack.
I'm happy with this one :-
http://www.c**tplaces.co.uk/phpBB2/album_page.php?pic_id=5246
I bought the 1 Watt LED from Bat Products.
I thought the idea was to get the same level of illumination from a smaller/lighter battery pack.
I'm happy with this one :-
http://www.c**tplaces.co.uk/phpBB2/album_page.php?pic_id=5246
I bought the 1 Watt LED from Bat Products.
D
darkplaces
Guest
Its nice to have access to BRIGHT LIGHTS without haulling large lamps about and have the option of intermediate light levels for general walking. Ideally I would like 3 light settings. I like the Myo's idea of a 20 second boost.
M
Mole
Guest
c**tplaces said:
My caplamp and 2 handhelds still weigh less than that FX5 you stagger about with. :roll: :roll:
C
cavespen
Guest
went and got my self an XP.
i was in OFD last weekend and it had more than enough light to it and ways nothing. 50 quid and it is fine. don't know how long it will last but all things used for cave brack something you just have to live with. any way everyone loves to tinker.
i was in OFD last weekend and it had more than enough light to it and ways nothing. 50 quid and it is fine. don't know how long it will last but all things used for cave brack something you just have to live with. any way everyone loves to tinker.
Troll, c**tplaces:
Yes, the B17 price is for the reflector unit, for people who already have homemade Oldham-based lightlng sets, Headlite sets, or FX3s. It's aimed at the same market segment as the 14-LED reflector units, at pretty much the same price, but with twin beams, and multi-power settings.
I'm not sure anyone who's used one has subsequently asked about the possibility of a brighter unit - most users are happy running one (or both) beams on medium power most of the time, only going up to 1Watt when necessary. Limiting to 1W also gives much more flexibility of design regarding dumping excess heat, and allows simple (and redundant) control electronics when running off 3.6-4.5V batteries.
I'm sure there's a range of personal taste in lighting - some people just like the most powerful lights, and only multiple-watt units will do for them, which is fair enough, whereas I'm happier with a little less light, and real-world battery life measured in days of caving, rather than hours.
For the market I aimed at - bright-enough-for-most-people, robust units for extended runtime on helmet mounted batteries for expedition and regular use, I think I've ended up with a pretty decent solution.
Given that 12 out of the 18 people on the expedition I'm about to go on are using my lights, and I don't even know 3 of the remaining 6, I'd guess I have at least targeted that particular niche (not really Nova territory) reasonably well.
Clearly, there's a world of difference between buying a light from someone you know and/or trust, after having seen it being used, (which is how I have got all my customers so far) and seeing a description on a website or forum. I'm not sure *I'd* buy anything without a good review or personal recommendation.
Yes, the B17 price is for the reflector unit, for people who already have homemade Oldham-based lightlng sets, Headlite sets, or FX3s. It's aimed at the same market segment as the 14-LED reflector units, at pretty much the same price, but with twin beams, and multi-power settings.
I'm not sure anyone who's used one has subsequently asked about the possibility of a brighter unit - most users are happy running one (or both) beams on medium power most of the time, only going up to 1Watt when necessary. Limiting to 1W also gives much more flexibility of design regarding dumping excess heat, and allows simple (and redundant) control electronics when running off 3.6-4.5V batteries.
I'm sure there's a range of personal taste in lighting - some people just like the most powerful lights, and only multiple-watt units will do for them, which is fair enough, whereas I'm happier with a little less light, and real-world battery life measured in days of caving, rather than hours.
For the market I aimed at - bright-enough-for-most-people, robust units for extended runtime on helmet mounted batteries for expedition and regular use, I think I've ended up with a pretty decent solution.
Given that 12 out of the 18 people on the expedition I'm about to go on are using my lights, and I don't even know 3 of the remaining 6, I'd guess I have at least targeted that particular niche (not really Nova territory) reasonably well.
Clearly, there's a world of difference between buying a light from someone you know and/or trust, after having seen it being used, (which is how I have got all my customers so far) and seeing a description on a website or forum. I'm not sure *I'd* buy anything without a good review or personal recommendation.
D
darkplaces
Guest
I guess I have been spoilt with my 10watts of FX5 power.
I did redcliffe mine last night and 10watts was far too much, I switched to my backup, a tikka plus with its 4 bright LEDs was ample for the maze like mine.
I did redcliffe mine last night and 10watts was far too much, I switched to my backup, a tikka plus with its 4 bright LEDs was ample for the maze like mine.
cap n chris
Well-known member
And I thought 5W was bright! 10W! - blinding. You must find GB Cavern impressive (cos you're probably the only person who can see the whole chamber).
Bear in mind the watt ratings aren't necessarily the best guide to light output, even if they are a good guide to run-time on a given battery.
For example, typical figures for FX 3/5 bulbs are
FX3 : 40 lumens with 2.4W bulb (17lm/watt)
FX5 : 40/90/160 lumens with 2.4/5/10W bulbs (17/18/16lm/Watt)
Current 1Watt and 3Watt Luxeons typically give around 33-45 lm/Watt at 1W consumption - between 2 and 3 times the efficiency of small halogen bulbs. The 5W Luxeons typically give ~24lm/Watt at full power.
Given that the efficiency ratings of the 1W devices have more than doubled in the space of a year, and there is definite room for further improvement, the next few years will see some interesting changes.
In the end, it does come down to the application - someone doing short trips where they want maximum light (and/or where everyone else has ultrabright lights), and where weight isn't a problem may well be best with a 10W FX5.
One thing I *have* noticed with my lights is that given a choice of two equally-powered beams, one a spot with some down-thrown light, and one a wide-angle with limited distance penetration, most people seem to use the wide beam much of the time, especially in narrow passage or crawls, where a spot beam can be an irritation.
A spot can be good for vertical sections, moving over boulders, or for extra detail on uneven muddy floors, but often isn't what is needed. The typical headset setup of bright main beam and dull pilot beam (complete with annoying banding from the reflector) isn't necessarily what people would choose, given a free choice.
For example, typical figures for FX 3/5 bulbs are
FX3 : 40 lumens with 2.4W bulb (17lm/watt)
FX5 : 40/90/160 lumens with 2.4/5/10W bulbs (17/18/16lm/Watt)
Current 1Watt and 3Watt Luxeons typically give around 33-45 lm/Watt at 1W consumption - between 2 and 3 times the efficiency of small halogen bulbs. The 5W Luxeons typically give ~24lm/Watt at full power.
Given that the efficiency ratings of the 1W devices have more than doubled in the space of a year, and there is definite room for further improvement, the next few years will see some interesting changes.
In the end, it does come down to the application - someone doing short trips where they want maximum light (and/or where everyone else has ultrabright lights), and where weight isn't a problem may well be best with a 10W FX5.
One thing I *have* noticed with my lights is that given a choice of two equally-powered beams, one a spot with some down-thrown light, and one a wide-angle with limited distance penetration, most people seem to use the wide beam much of the time, especially in narrow passage or crawls, where a spot beam can be an irritation.
A spot can be good for vertical sections, moving over boulders, or for extra detail on uneven muddy floors, but often isn't what is needed. The typical headset setup of bright main beam and dull pilot beam (complete with annoying banding from the reflector) isn't necessarily what people would choose, given a free choice.
