Author Topic: Kong Indy Evo  (Read 906 times)

Offline Jon

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Kong Indy Evo
« on: November 28, 2018, 11:43:25 pm »
Has anyone used one of these?

https://www.kong.it/en/2-products/items/f19-descenders/p280-indy-evo

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Offline TheGrave

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #1 on: November 29, 2018, 03:02:00 am »
Asked about the newer version (Indy Evo Plus) in Cavers of Facebook group and here is what I got:

Yuval Sobolyev

Pros:
1. Unlike Stop, it really stops even on thin ropes (8.5-9mm)
2. Bobins are much thicker and durable than in the Stop
3. Panic proof mechanism

Cons:
1. The Bobins can not be replaced
2. Very heavy (480g vs 326g)
3. Auto lock can not be disabled
4. The mechanism that lock it close made of metal and tends to bend and get stuck in an open position

Offline JoW

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #2 on: November 29, 2018, 07:30:54 am »
I tried one a couple of years ago and I found it incredibly difficult to use the handle and almost couldn't descended at all...! Though I guess it must work well for some people - maybe it depends on weight/strength etc?

What feature was it you liked the look of?

Offline andrewmc

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2018, 09:03:12 am »
2. Very heavy (480g vs 326g)

Heavier than a Petzl Rig, I would point out...

Offline Jon

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #4 on: November 29, 2018, 09:20:31 am »
I tried one a couple of years ago and I found it incredibly difficult to use the handle and almost couldn't descended at all...! Though I guess it must work well for some people - maybe it depends on weight/strength etc?

What feature was it you liked the look of?
I just like to keep abreast of alternative kit, wondered if it was worth trying.

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Offline Pete K

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #5 on: November 29, 2018, 12:09:46 pm »
On clean, supple, 10mm rope they are okay. On anything fatter, stiffer or dirtier, they are awful.
SRT descending it's jumpy, either on or off with a tiny sweet spot. Almost useless for hauling and rescue due to the top 'claw'.

I've used one professionally in a 'lowering' type setup for the last 4 years. We'd use a Stop, but the bobbins wore out in 2 weeks. The Kong lasts 6 months being stainless steel. Also worth noting that the new version has a life limit of 7500m of descent. We could hit that in a week, so now we're swapping to RIG2s and the Kong is history.
Get a RIG2, they are great.

Offline yuvals

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #6 on: November 29, 2018, 01:06:25 pm »
Asked about the newer version (Indy Evo Plus) in Cavers of Facebook group and here is what I got:

Yuval Sobolyev

Pros:
1. Unlike Stop, it really stops even on thin ropes (8.5-9mm)
2. Bobins are much thicker and durable than in the Stop
3. Panic proof mechanism

Cons:
1. The Bobins can not be replaced
2. Very heavy (480g vs 326g)
3. Auto lock can not be disabled
4. The mechanism that lock it close made of metal and tends to bend and get stuck in an open position

You took the words out of my mouth  :lol:

Offline Jon

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2018, 09:35:11 pm »
On clean, supple, 10mm rope they are okay. On anything fatter, stiffer or dirtier, they are awful.
SRT descending it's jumpy, either on or off with a tiny sweet spot. Almost useless for hauling and rescue due to the top 'claw'.

I've used one professionally in a 'lowering' type setup for the last 4 years. We'd use a Stop, but the bobbins wore out in 2 weeks. The Kong lasts 6 months being stainless steel. Also worth noting that the new version has a life limit of 7500m of descent. We could hit that in a week, so now we're swapping to RIG2s and the Kong is history.
Get a RIG2, they are great.
I see the Rig is for 10mm +, have you tried it on 9mm?

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Offline Pete K

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2018, 10:56:28 pm »
9mm and up fine as a descender for RIG2.
"EN 15151-1 when used with a 9 to 10.5 mm rope"
https://www.petzl.com/GB/en/Professional/Descenders/RIG
I've used it with 9mm Gleistein and you do need the extra friction of a braking krab.

Offline al

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #9 on: November 29, 2018, 11:03:28 pm »
I see the Rig is for 10mm +, have you tried it on 9mm?

Yes - used my Rig regularly on 9mm - no braking krab needed.
Old ... but not old enough to know any better

Offline Mark Wright

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #10 on: November 29, 2018, 11:19:07 pm »
9mm and up fine as a descender for RIG2.
"EN 15151-1 when used with a 9 to 10.5 mm rope"
https://www.petzl.com/GB/en/Professional/Descenders/RIG
I've used it with 9mm Gleistein and you do need the extra friction of a braking krab.

EN15151-1 is a belay device standard and the 9 to 10.5mm relates to dynamic rope, not low stretch.

The min. 10mm rope that Jon refers to is the minimum low stretch rope diameter used for testing to the EN12841C descender device standard.

No problem using thinner ropes, just be aware they may not perform as well as when using 10mm+ diameter ropes.

Mark


Offline Hammy

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #11 on: November 29, 2018, 11:44:03 pm »
No problem using thinner ropes, just be aware they may not perform as well as when using 10mm+ diameter ropes.

Doesn’t the fact that the Rig  may not perform as well as with the correct rope diameter constitute a problem?

Surely either it performs as it should do and is safe, or it isn’t.

Offline Mark Wright

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #12 on: November 30, 2018, 12:55:43 am »
Its not really about the 'correct' rope diameter.

EN12841C is an industrial standard and as such the rope diameters used for testing need to be EN1891A which generally have a range of diameters between 10 and 11.5mm.

EN15151-1 is a sports climbing standard and as such the rope diameters used for testing need to be EN892 which generally have a range of diameters between 9 and 10.5mm.

Stops are tested against the EN341A rescue descender standard and as such the rope diameters used for testing need to be EN1891A & B, Type B (Rescue Rope), generally having a range of diameters between 9 and 11.5mm.

Rigs are tested against all the above EN standards.

There is no EN standard for caving descenders so we take our advice from the user instructions and any other relevant sources of information, here for instance or the Petzl website.

If you use a Stop with 8mm accessory cord, which many cavers have done over the years, it isn't unsafe, you just have to be aware that the auto-lock facility may not work as well as when using thicker ropes and it may be a bit quick so you have to be reasonably experienced in its use in all conditions and take extra care.

Mark

« Last Edit: November 30, 2018, 01:05:55 am by Mark Wright »

Offline JoW

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #13 on: November 30, 2018, 07:39:32 am »
The only possible 'advantage' of the indy over the rigs is the anti panic function, if you wanted that you'd have to go for a Petzl ID or possibly an edelrid eddy, though I don't know if anyone that's used one of those underground.

Offline andrewmc

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #14 on: November 30, 2018, 07:44:21 am »
I find my Rig (old model) goes easily on fat 11m club rope (which a Stop doesn't), and stops reliably on slick 9mm (which a Stop doesn't). So I find it better at both ends of the spectrum than a Stop; I haven't tried it on 8mm yet but it did still lock up on the horrific 9mm mud tubes that passed for ropes on exped as long as you 'bounced' it at rebelays...

Offline TheGrave

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #15 on: March 19, 2019, 10:54:34 pm »
On clean, supple, 10mm rope they are okay. On anything fatter, stiffer or dirtier, they are awful.
SRT descending it's jumpy, either on or off with a tiny sweet spot. Almost useless for hauling and rescue due to the top 'claw'.

I've used one professionally in a 'lowering' type setup for the last 4 years. We'd use a Stop, but the bobbins wore out in 2 weeks. The Kong lasts 6 months being stainless steel. Also worth noting that the new version has a life limit of 7500m of descent. We could hit that in a week, so now we're swapping to RIG2s and the Kong is history.
Get a RIG2, they are great.

I see RIG2 quoted in many places but on Petzl's website it's just RIG. Is this a second version of the same product? How do I distinguish it from the old one?

Offline Pete K

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Re: Kong Indy Evo
« Reply #16 on: March 20, 2019, 12:54:13 am »
Second version of the RIG, which I think Petzl called a RIG2 when it was announced but dropped the 2 when old one ceased production. Anyway, current RIG model has the stainless steel wear plate on the side and a handle that returns to lock automatically and does not require manually locking off.